Jit v Uzb. stalo dermova

[Doggy]

bratya nujni vashi mneniye pro temu "jizn stanovitsya dermova" :?:

Doggy ozing dermosan, basherenga s..key sani,
Kordimbir ikkita postlarini, k...k bormi u uerda yashab yolib ketmisanmi katta "jizn kruta" bolsa oashakka, ogzinga karab gapir!!!!!

[Doggy]

Nu rebyata gde vi i vashi mneniye?

[joe parker]

doggy,

prochel che guest napisal? a chem ne mnenie? vot i dumay, prejde chem govorit'.

[hmm]

Ehh, Guest, nega unaqa gaplar bilan savol soragan odamni silkitib tashlayapsan? U sandan savol soravatti, sani esa began jovingga qarab odam uyalib ketadi. Berilgan savolning m'anosi bor.

[Username]

Jizn v Uzbekistane harasho tamu u kovo "$dengi$" yest
Eto formula Kapitalism
V Capitalism vse neravni
Tak chto v obshem govarya Jizn Ne Dermova

[Spydernet]

Soglasen s Doggy:
1) Human rights violation
2) Politics screwed up (peeps who have the authority steal money from people and government through bribery)
3) New stupid policies like temporary bazaar shutdowns and curfew hours at 12:00 at night (I wonder how Uzbek youth feels about that)?
4) Studpid policies and reforms on the tax structure (banning all sole proprietors)
5) The whole economic ideology is shit especially 5 principles.
6) Spritiual life is banned (any religion is being prosecuted no matter what you are)
7) ****ed up media (Example: GDP raises 1.2% that's ****ing bull)
8) When they banned internet (It completely threw me off), ****ing morons
9) Exploitation of the youth (cotton campaigns), students spend 3 monthes in the fields getting sick, missing out on education, and eating shit)
10) Military recruitment (Uzbekistan has the biggest military in whole Central Asia - blyad STROIBAT, u polkovnika ogorodi kapat Armiya) Eto vot Umidovtsev vozyat v Chirchiq, oni hot tam chut chut postrelyayut i avtomat poderjat, a vot rayonkim potsanam ne legko, pizdyat ih kak hotyat, making slaves out of them) Look at US and Boot camps at Marine corps. this is a real military and ne kucha blya baranov kotorie voobshe za dva goda v Rukah avtomat ne derjali.
____________
Most of the Umidies and guys who are being educated abroad; don't want to return. Because as they said in the Movie BRAT-2 "Horosho tam gde zadnitsa v teple". Vot tak.
"In US you can work for a month and have car and a cell phone. " - this is just an example. V Uzbekistane esli net svyazei or if you didn't hook up with a cool job schitai pizdets.
Peace Wease,
Spy

USERNAME , spasibki za mneniye, a chto budut delat lyudi u kotorih net etih
$deneg$ ?

[Muhlis]

Spydernet salom,
Your critiques have come logic I have to admit this. Hovewer, let me tell something. No nation (tday's prosperious nations) reached affluency ovenight or easily.... Even the US, which you gave as an example had a great sons who sacrifised their knowledge, ability, skills and lives where necessary to reach today's economic and social stability...

President Wodrow Wilson accerted that: " The nation's honor is dearer than the nation's comfort; yes the nations life itself".

Do you see, even a country which does not have homogenious nationality had so much pride! He said " dearer than nation's pride and its life"!, if we apply this words to our nation, its honor is more important that nations pleasures (including your's and mine too).
So, you aren't you ashamed to say such a bad words about your nation and it's government as "shit"? You were not you empabarassed to site from russian entertainment movie to approve and defend some "Umid" fund scholars' shameless behaviour which can be equalized with betrayal of nation and country!
Perhaps, many people have told you that those two "shits" (our nation and government) paid their education! If they are doing some things wrong it is natural, they educated you and other smart young people to correct them, not to escape from civillian duty to another countries and call them shit.
I am sorry, maybe you are not like that. Maybe you really want to make some changes in our Fatherland! I do not know, I just gave my opinions.

[Spydernet]

Greeting to Muhlis,

Thank for the critique. It's true that even USA had troubles with economy in the past. But that was a matter of time they lived in.
All these countries send financial aid, loans, and other resources.
These resources either going to somebody's pocket or exploited and utilized in a wrong way. For instance, let's take internet -> remember when they banned internet in Uzbekistan. Don't you think it is stupid.
And all those abovementioned dillemas that I posted in my first message, I mean those new rulez are unreasonable.
I am a patriot of my country, but sometimes I doubt that I even should be. Well, I'd like to help Uzbekistan, but there for that I got to sacrifice my health, time, sometimes even life. Because if I had an authority I would make a lot of changes. There are a lot of things that are going on that we have no idea about. So, I just want to live my life and don't want to judge other people. So I think what you have said is very patriotic and in some ways smart. Although if you think a little bit how you were brainwashed. After independence the way all those classes they taught about government. I think that was a brainwash. Sometimes some people get mad at me in the States that I criticize US, and tell them how great Uzbekistan is. I think I wrote too much. I guess that would be enough.
Peace,
Spy

[Doggy]

Molodets i spasibki za mneniye spydernet. Ya neznayu otkuda ti tak mnogo mneniy nabral but still good. A kto ne snami , tot znachit naslushalsya etogo obmana kak nas uchat v uroki Mafkura i Manaviat ili tipa togo, nenujniye slova, chistiy lagman kirgizskiy. Thanks buddy.

Sry hi,
I glad that you got the meaning of my message!
I agree that some (maybe many) policies of todays government does not represent the interests of our nation. Howver, you loosing your point by confusing Nation and State. When you are not happy with State (temporary) policies, you do Not have to call all Nation and Country as "shit". As for barainwash, my brain is not a laundry (not dirty as well:)
to be washed! I did not study in new uzbek schools too long (just 4 years). In addition, you do NOT have any authority or legal rights to call or "think" tham my brain is "washed". I do not see anything BAD in supporting INDEPENDENT UZBEKISTAN (many people underestimate the value of this notion)! I remember the last expulsions of that totalitarian regime based on RUSSIAN NATIUONALISM! I lived through that time, i remember everything! LAst decade of the Union was real SHIT, believe me! It even worse than todays Uzbekistan, so that is why i prefer INDEPENDENT UZBEKISTAN.
Dear freind, you do not have to tell them how great Uzbekistan is. Now we have what we deserve. What we have is young, educated and "progressive" people like you who can call a whole NATION as "shit" witn no responsibility for the meaning and correctness of his/her expression!
"If i had an authority"???? What does it mean???? Authority is not a gift or present! You cannot "just" get it as a gift!!!! And nowhere! Even in US or Canada you have deserve it!
Today many countries, have beuroctratic/hierarhical command based administrative structures. Almost all the countries in the world!
As for, earning an aouthority you have to proove that you deserve it! Calling the whole nation as "shit" and its people brainwashed!
My best regards to you

[*Wraith*]

USERNAME , spasibki za mneniye, a chto budut delat lyudi u kotorih net etih
$deneg$ ?

КЛЮЧ К УСПЕХУ - В ПРОБУЖДЕНИИ ГОРДОСТИ ЛЮДЕЙ,
В ЗАДЕЙСТВОВАНИИ ИХ ПОТЕНЦИАЛА И ВСЕХ ВОЗМОЖНОСТЕЙ
:nosmiley:

[Doggy]

Ey ti guest, ti prav v tom chto u nas eti umnoye pokoleniye est. A im mesto robotat u bolshih stolah, da. No eti stola uje davno rezervirvani dlya ditishek etih koruptsionerov. Toist eti stoli uje Kuplini. Yesli neverish, dlya premera u menya yest drug, nu umniy. Spets po diplamatii. Ti mojesh obeshat chto on #1 dlya ambassadora of Uzbekistan v USA? Net. On uje 5 let pitajetsya. Diplom vse na 5. Kakiye on projecti nedelal tib videl. No net u nego daje informatsii netu pro embassy in USA. Ti mojesh sprosit, eti ditishki koruptsioner bolsalar ham eplayaptiku. Ya skaju eplayapti, no berilib emas. A ih robota vsyo ravno ne ih. A teh kto nesmog sest na etot stol. Prosto eti sinki kak ya uje skazal koruptsionerov oni prosto plyatyat etim nesmogshem lyudim. Masalan prosto 50$ tolasa o'zlari esa 5000$ olishadi. Nu kak tebe?

[Spydernet]

Doggy thanks for the support.
I think what the Doggy says is true.
We all say Gordost, gordost; how can people have a pride when they are socially, spiritually, and morally devastated. 60% of the Uzbek population lives in rural areas. Ask them how they feel, not the people who are sitting their asses in the government or abroad. All those farmers have to wake up at 5am and bend their back until the dusk otherwise they will die from hunger.
Doggy already mentioned about the jobs. Like imagine me coming back home and if I am a son of a man who doesn't have any connections or influence. I am screwed for the most part.
I know, I worked for a Chemical Company, a billion $ project in Uzbekistan. Guess how I got hired, through the people I know.
Guess who took over the position, a friend of mine. That's how it works. It is really hard to get into things.
Speaking of brainwashing, it is a term and i didn't say you were brainwashed (to a person who had some negativity about it), so sorry bro
I didn't refer it to you, but people with too much pride who are sometimes blind. In US people vote, there is a corruption, but at least votes count.
Do you know how laws are enacted in US or in a certain state.
People go around and get signitures from people and if they get enough of them, they enact the law. In Uzbekistan goverment does the whole part and people can't even say nothing.
I saw a track of the GDP from 1991 to 2002 I think it was UN data:
well starting from 1991-2001 we progressively declined in GDP and income per capita. It all summarize into how government made its decision.
Just the news that Uzbek people flee to Kazakstan to get a decent clothes and get them for cheaper it's killing me man. All these years we were trying to keep the hard currency in Uzbekistan treasury and the state.
Here it comes, look what is happening it's absurd.
Speaking of nation, I am Uzbek and I am proud. I when I refered the word shit that was to the state in terms of government.
Although, if you think about it. Let's take an example with your Uzbek mentality and pride, you got an administrative position in the government/company, now there is a job opening and you have a brightest guy who just graduated a college from abroad and has the greatest accomplishments and you have your cousine/brother with some knowledge of english and may be decent student. Who are you gonna hire? Your brother. I think there should be a third party commitee for hiring people into any positions until people will start to realize that
"HONESTY IS THE BEST POLICY". But when people starving there isn't any honesty. People tolerate those things for a long time, until it becomes massive and explodes.
I love my country and always want the best for my country, but it is hard to succeed when it's not really free.
Peace,
Spy

Hi all,
Doggy i am sorry if you want to say something to me say it Uzbek or in English ok.
Spy this time you tried to be more objective. You know what you have touched very neat points in your point. Rural population of uzbekistan!
What i was tring to say is we do not have to blame government in all negative things and other problems. Sometimes we also contribute to this very largely as a citizens.
We also must have a law like Equal opportunity in the us. However, do not tell me that, citiens pass laws in the us. LEgislative branch of the us passes all the federal laws and local legislative branches pass all local state laws, it very simple, just a federal system of governing. If you saw some people gathering citzens' signatures, this can everything from public poll about the potential law organized by government agencies, ngos, lobbyists and so on...but only legislative branch can pass the law in accordanse with the other 2 branches agreements....
As for putting or giving jobs for people who you know is not really so bad thing is called political patronage, even in the us when a big beurocrate changes he changes virually all offices and it natural.
We just need better politcal environment, we just need to improve our national statehood and if you call current government as "shit" so "bravely" it does not necassarily mean that you are contributing to the development of our Patherland. I know that our country deserve much more than what it has now....But we cannot change anyrthing calling our Nation and government as "shit" "hrenova" and so on. We need to unite and create some sort of new stream in our society, while not opposing current government, because it has virtually al the laws to start our efforts in towards the development.
Dear spy you and others like you are responsible to our countries future, so you must be optimistic! Optimism is very important quality for leadership. I am not saying to be "blind optimmist" but enough to give courage to others who are ready to follow you in order to bring about positive changes in our society....
We need to do many changes in our society...You said 60% of our population live in rual areas.. right! but look how they are treated by their "urban" fellows. We just need to develop more strong moral codes which would keep our nation together. But "manaviyat" policy is not the best way to develop a strong moral code...There should be lie examples...not only "great ancestors" but live and real people...So, and other young and well educated people must be responsible for this. This. in turn, again requires sacrifese and big optimism from you and people like you...this must not nesassarily be your carrier or life...mayby it very simple thing but we must do them virtually every day. For instance: if you stopped by "gai" and urged to pay bribes or pay more money to the bank, choose the second option. Of course it is not a big thing, but if many epople do it, it eventually lead to positive change, those "gai" will stop "hunting" on poor drivers by hiding behind bushes..... The same method can be successful in many areas...but we need to be optimistic and fair! We need first of all that our felves that our efforts will bring about positive changes and then we need to enlage our scope and encorage others to join....In this, case youdo not need to oppose government. Just we need to contribute to create a good and organized society.
My, fiend am sorry if am writing too long, but you know, i sometimes i ask young teenagers who are just about to start their life and profeccional education questions like: who you are going to be? or Wher are you going to study?. When i get answers, i become sad and disappointed...Their answers usually are: i will become a cop, snb agent, customs worker, tax agent and lawer. Why, the answer i find for myself is very sad. It seemsto me that they choose those profeccions, they see in them big opportunities to solicit bribes.....that is the majot reason what makes them to prefer those professions....If you see young people of china, japan or other counties, they try to study ingineering, IT scienses and many other similar field which are very important in the development of the country.... We are we going like that?
There are many other things which i can talk very long, but i do not see a big need for that.
What i want to say is we must be optimist regarless any circumstanses, show positive examples to others, get organized in order to bring about positive changes, provoke courage and hope in our peoples lives by our activities rather that calling our Nation and state "shit".
to be continued,
Muhlis,

[Saturn]

Guest you wrote:
"What i was tring to say is we do not have to blame government in all negative things and other problems. Sometimes we also contribute to this very largely as a citizens. "

You mean we have to blame ourselves? - Что такого негативного мы контрибют делаем как граждане? Я не понимаю почему мы должны чувствовать себя виноватыми в том, что в Республике такой упадок ? Что такого, что требовалось от граждан Узбекистане, что мы являясь гражданами этой Республики не сделали? Народ Узбекистана что ли трибунага чикволиб хокимиятдаги одамлага турли-туман нарсалани ваъда кивоттими? Или наоборот? Поэтому мы и виним власть. Я считаю, что наш народ очень трудолюбивый и терпеливый, даже чересчур. Возьмем к примеру табачную фабрику в Самарканде Узб-Британское СП. Работа на табачной фабрике доволно тяжелая, есть даже цехи с вредными условиями труда (конечно же люди получают доплату за вредность), но если посмотреть на рабочих фабрики они все очень довольны, даже счастливы что у них есть работа - на табачной фабрике!!! Или же женщины которые рано утром выстраиавлись в очередь перед Кабул Тектсиль на Гулзоре, чтобы их приняли на работу, на фабрику!!! Я не знаю как, какие ****ing экономические меры требуются для того чтобы обеспечить трудовые места, но создай людям хотя бы это! И вы Гость говорите, что мы понимаете ли делаем свой вклад в деградацию, чем, тем, что хотим работать и кормить своих детей??? Говорят, на ишака, который больше поклажы везет, все больше груза накладывают, так и наше правительство, накладывает на нас, накладывает, ждет пока мы надорвемся чтоли?

Saturn yozsangiz odamga ohshab yozing iltimos. Man sizni hatingizni okiganim yok. Bu fikr emas, "****in" deyishdan boshka yana nimani bilasiz???
Yana bir narsa manga ozbekcha yoki englizcha youzing agar yozishni lozim topsangiz..., man urischani yahshi tushunmayman, rahmat e'tiboringiz uchun,
Muhlis.

[Saturn]

Guest you wrote:
"What i was tring to say is we do not have to blame government in all negative things and other problems. Sometimes we also contribute to this very largely as a citizens. "

Олдинги ёзганимнинг "Мехмон" учун таржимаси - Сизингизча биз узимизни айбдорлашимиз керак-ми? - Узбекистоннинг фукоролари булиб биз нима иш килиб Республикамиздаги негатив ходисаларга уз хиссамизни кушяпмиз? Нима учун бу негатив ходисалар учун биз узимизни айбдор хис килишимиз керак? Узбекистон фукоролари булиб туриб биздан талаб этилган кайси ишни биз килмаёпмиз? Нима оддий фукароларми минбарга чикволиб хокимиятдаги одамлага турли-туман нарсалани ваъда кивотган? Ёки аксинчами? Шунинг учун биз хокимиятни айбдорлаймиз. Менинг фикримча бизнинг халкимиз жуда мехнаткаш ва ута сабр токатлидир. Мисол учун Самарканддаги Узбек-Британия КК олсак. Бу тамаки фабрикасида иш анча огир, хаттоки соглик учун зарар шароитли цехлар хам бор (албатта ишчилар бу зарарли шароитлар учун кушиммча тулов олишади), лекин бу ишчиларни курсангиз улар хаммаси рози булиб ишлайди, хаттоки иш жойлари борлигидан бахтиёр деса хам булади - ва бу иш жой оддий тамаки фабрикаси!!! Ёки Гулзордаги Кабул Текстилга ишга кираман деб азонда фабриканинг дарвозаси олдига тупланган канчадан-канча аёллар-чи?! Билмадим иш жойларини яратиш учун кандай иктисодий ислохатлар утказилиши керак (сизга ёкмаган сузни олиб ташадим таржимадан), хеч булмаса шу яратиб берилсин! Сиз булсангиз Республикадаги деградацияга биз фукоролар уз хиссамизни кушяпмиз деяпсиз, нима килиб, ишлашни хохлаганимиз ва бола-чакамизни бокмокчи булганимиз биланми?

[Guest]

ne dermovo, a dermovato, navernoye

[Ilhom]

ne dermovo, a dermovato, navernoye Guest sani o`zingni mustaqil fikring bormi o`zi ? boshida topik sohibini rosa bo`ralatib so`kkanding endi esa uni ma`qullayapsan :rolleyes: tushunmadim sanga

[Muhlis]

Saturn, birodar juda yahshi!

Mani sizga boshka gapim yok man bogdan kelsam siz togdan kelyapsiz...
boshka gapim yok sizga,
Hutmatla,
Muhlis.

[Doggy]

eeeee rebyata, kak vi pomniti chto vsyotaki etot forum dlya krititiki a ne dlya rozborok.

[Muhlis]

Doggy,
Neujeli ti hochesh skazat chto abzivat tseliy narod i stranu s ulichnimi slavami KRITIKOY! Ya znal chto ti legkamislenniy chelavek no nedatakoy stepeni!
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