Uzbek shaharlaridagi rus hukmronligi yana kancha davom etadi

[MUHLIS]

Salomlar. Men anchadan beri shu narsa hakida yozmokchi bolib yurgan edim. Mana bugun nasib etgan ekan bugun yozmokdaman. Albatta, bugungi kunda Vatanimiz hakida juda kopchilik "kayguradigan" bolib kolgan va mening kamtarona fikrlarim ommaning e'tiborini oziga jalb etadimi yokmi buni vakt korsatadi.
Hullas, men Uzbekistonda bir kancha vaktdan beri bolmagan bolsamda, ammo yakin otmishdagi hotiralarimga tayangan holda, oz fikrlarimni bayon etmokchi edim. Men kotarib chikayotgan masala esa, vatanimizda sobik "katta ogamiz" vakillarining mahalliy madaniyat va tilga va umuman Millatimizga blgan munosabati hakida boladi. Men yana shu orinda ta'kidlab otmokchimanki, mening fkrlarim rus millatiga karshi karatilgan emas, va mening maksadim ushbu millatni kaysidir bir ma’noda kamsitishdan iborat emas.
Uzbekistonning demografik tarkibiga nazar tashlaydigan bolsak, ruslar oz sonli millatlar ichida eng kattalaridan biridur. Keling ularni boshka oz sonli millatlardan farklariga bir nazar tashlaylik, ma’lumki, ruslar asosan Uzbekistonning markaziy shaharlariga ornashgan. Ularning eng katta kismi Toshkent shahrida yashaydi. Ruslar vatanimizdagi boshka millat vakillaridan farkli olarok fakat shaharlarda yashaydi. Men kishlokga yashaydigan tatarni, tojikni, kirgizni korganman. Men dalada ketmon kotarib yurgan karisni korganman, kazakni korganman, nemisni korganman ammo urusni kormaganman negadir. Hullas, ruslar, “ilgor madaniyatga erishgan” va “urbanizatsiyalashgan” millat vakillari sifatida fakat shaharlarda istikomat kiladi.
Endi ularning, mahalliy halkka bolgan munosabatlari hakida ham bir-ikki ogiz soz aytsam. Uzbekistonning katta-katta shaharlariga guj-guj bolib toplanib olgan uruslar ozlarini u u yerlarda juda ham yahshi his kiladilar. Birgina Toshkent shahri misolida masalaga bokadigan bolsak, ushbu tarihiy shahar, 19 asrlardan boshlab rus amaldorlarining Turkiston olkasini boshkaruv markazi sifatida hizmat kilgan. Shubhasizki, usha davrlarda rus amaldorlari mahaliy milat vakillariga vahshiylarcha munosabatda bolganlar. Tarihiy manbalarga murojaat etadigan bolsak boskinchi general Fon Kaufman hech kachon mahalliy milat vakillari bilan kol berib sorashmagan. Sovet davriga kelib vaziyat biroz ozgardi. Endlikda, ruslar ozlarini mahalliy millat vakillariga “ornak” sifatida korasata boshladilar. Tarihimizda sanab adogiga yetib bolmaydigan darajada sohtalashtirishlar yuz bera boshladi,bunga eng katta hissa koshganlardan biri akademik Bartold bolgan, shuning uchun bolsa kerak, “panturkist”, “millatchi” tamgalarini olgan, “Jadidchilik” harakating asoschilaridan biri, bekiyos iste’dod sohibi, Ismoil Gaspirali ogli u kimsani hech hush kormagan. Vaktida Bartold unga ozi bilan “hamkorlik” kilishni taklif etgan, ammo Ismoil Gaspirali ogli ushbu manfur taklifni rad etgan. Umumlashtirib aytadigan bolsak, Sovet davriga kelib “sovetlashtirish” va “ruslashtirish” keng avj ola boshladi…Ushbu siyosiy jarayon esa olkada yashovchi rus millatiga mansub kishilar uchun ulkan imkoniyatlar bera boshladi. Endilikda ular ozlarini tola ma’nodagi “ulug oga” sifatida kora boshladilar. Kattik ta’zik va ta’kiklar ostida chorasiz kolgan mahaliy millat vakillari ham ularga ergashishdan ozga chora topa olmay koldilar….
Mana shu uzok tarihiy va siyosiy jarayonlar mobaynida biznning olkamizda yashovchi rus millatiga mansub kishilar ongida ozlarini “eng eng eng” deb hisoblash, boshka millatlar ustidan hukmronlik hissi shakllandi. Taassuflar bolsinkim endi, bu gurug safiga nafakat ruslar balki uzok muddatli siyosat samarasi olarok tashkil topgan “ruscha sozlashuvchi”lar ham koshilgan edilar. “Ruscha sozlashuvchi”lar asoosan koreyslar,tatarlar va boshka oz sonli millatlar va kisman uzbeklardan tashkil topdi. Bu gurug hozirgi kunda ham “ulug rus” millatchiligining sodik askarlari va ishonchli, sinovdan otgan kuroli hisoblanadi.
Ruslar mana shu tarzda, bizning shaharlarimizda misli korilmagan darajada obru e’tibor va hukmronlikka erishdi. Albatta, bunda bizning millatimizning sifatlaridan ham juda ustakorlik bilan foydalanildi, ya’ni “mehmondostlik”, koni-koshnichilik”, musulmonchilik”….yuzasidan mahalliy millat vakillari ularni dilini ogritishdan andisha kildi va hozirgi kunda ham bundan istihola kilib kelmokda va men Millatimizning ushbu hatti-harakatlari tahsinga sazovor deb bilaman. Shu asnoda shaharlarimiz, hususan Toshkent shahrida ruslar va rus tili hukmron til darajasiga chikdi. Ammo bu shunday davom etishi mumkin emas edi albatta, 80 chi yillarda Uzbek ziyolilari orasida Uzbek tiliga etarli e’tibor berilmayotgani va milliylik havf ostida kolayotgani hakida tahlika va sarosima avjiga chikdi….Buning natijasi olarok 1987 yil oktyabrida Uzbek tiliga Davlat makomi berildi. Keyinrok esa, Tangri Taoloning marhamati bilan istiklolga erishdik…..
Afuski, bu bilan ham hozirgi kunda ham kor narsa ozgargani yok. Oddiy bir uzbek sifatida Toshkent shahriga kirib kelar ekansiz, hayratga tusha boshlaysiz. Guyoki Rossiyada yurganga ohshaysan kishi….Agar Eski Shahar va ba’zi bir boshka joylarni hisobga olmasa, rus shaharlaridan farki kolmaydi….Men okuvchiga shuni alohida ta’kidlab otmokchi edimki, mening maksadim Toshkentlik Uzbeklarni nafsoniyatiga tegish yoki ularni kamsitish emas, balki ularni oz shaharlarining Tolakonli egalari sifatida korish. Shuning uchun, mening ba’zi bir haddan ziyod tankisiy fikrlarimni togri anglarsiz degan umiddaman. Men Toshkentda yashar ekanman, ona tilim, Uzbek tilim menga deyarli kerak emasligini achchik bir alam bilan tan ola boshladim….Aftobusda, metroda, oshxonayu restoranlarda…kochada, bozorda hamma hamma yerda rus tili hukmron. Lekin, Allohga shukrki, Toshkentda ham Uzbeklar bor…Shuning uchun har holda chidasa boladi.
Endi tilni bir yokka koyaylikda, til egalari, “ruscha sozlashuvchilar” ruslar hakida biroz fikr yuritsak. Men bir narsani aytishim mumkinki, mustakillik yillarida ham ular ozlarining “hukmronlik” da’volarinidan voz kechganlaricha yok. Aksincha, ular Rossiyada bugungi kunda avj olayotgan rus natsizmi akidalaridan ma’naviy ozuka olmokdalar. Oddiy bir misol tortta uzbek orasida bitta oris bolsa, torttala ozbek ham uruscha gapirishga majbur…Albatta, bu holatda u 4 ta ozbekni hatti harakatini yuksak did va farsatga ega kishilar harakatiga yuyish mumkin. Ammo bu holatni boshka tomondan tahlil kilish ham mumkin, ya’ni bitta urus 4 ta ozbekka oz sozini otkazmokda…..Albatta, “ruscha sozlashuvchilar” va ruslar birinchi yodashishni hamisha misol kilib korsatadilar va yukoridagi 4 ozbekka ohshash hatti-harakat kilishga boshkalarni ham ruhlantiradilar…Shu Orinda bir savol tugiladi, hosh shu did-farosat va madaniyat va oliyjanoblik hakida bizga orgatayotgan kishing ozida osha narsalardan akalli bittasi bormikan? Menimcha yok, agar bolganda, bunday holat yuz bermasdi. Farosatli kishi, didli kishi, madaniyatli kishi, andishali kishi 4! Odamni bitta ozi tufayli begona tilga sozlashishga majbur etmagan bolardi menimcha. Mana endi oydinlashmokda kim-kimga didu farosat madaniyatu oliyjanoblik hakida dars berishi kerakligi. Bilmadim boshkalar ham kuzatgan bolishi mumkin, ba’zan ozingiz bilmagan holda, behosdan, ba’zi bir “ruscha sozlashuvchilar”ga yoki ruslarga Uzbekcha murojaat etib yuborsangiz…..Ularning yuzida shunday bir nafrat va gazab zohir boladiki…men buni kop kuzatganman….Va ota kopol bir hangda “Ya po Uzbekski ne ponimayu” deydi….yoki “Gavari pa russki!!!” deydi….bir dona ortikcha savol bersangiz sizni millatchidan millatchiga solib ayuhannos sola boshlaydi…..Shumi yoki boshka narsalarmi sabab, poytahtlik “ruscha sozlashuvchilar” va ruslar viloyatlardan kelgan ozbeklarga nisbatan cheksiz nafrat va hurmatsizlikni namoyish etadilar….Chunki, ularning nazariga aynan shu kishilar ularning markaziy shaharlardagi “hukmronlik”lariga zarar keltirishi mumkinday tuyulsa kerak…Tuygu sozini ishlatdim balki eng birinchi instinct ya’ni korkuv desam togrirok bolarmidi….Viloyatlardan kelgan kishilarni kamsitish uchun birinchi sabab kilib ularning rus tilini yetarli darajada bilmasliklari korsatiladi va aynan shu narsa tahkir va hakoratlarga sabab boladi! Bu boradi ular shaharlik ozbeklarni ham oz saflariga undaydilar…millatdosh tuygusidan “shahardosh” tuygusini ustun koyishga erishadilar….
Kachongacha shunday holat davom etadi? Mana yakinda 2005 chi yil ham keladi….Biz unga tayyormizmi? Menimcha biz hushyorrok bolmogimiz lozim. Konun oz yoliga uning ijrosi oz yoliga…Mana shunday savollar meni kiynaydi…Men Hudo hohlasa keyingi hatimda ommayviy ahborot vositalari va hususan Internet va undagi til masalalari hakida yozmokchiman.

[IsraDen]

Zo'r maqola. Shu haqida fikrimni bildiraman.
Hozirgi paytda "Davlat tli haqida" qonunni ozgina o'zgarish kerak. Va reformani maktablarda va boshqa bilim yurtlarida o'tkazish kerak. Hozir rus maktablarda o'zbek tili ikkinchi til sifatida turyapti. Shu kabi maktablarda har bir narsa u faqat rus tilida. O'zimmman rus maktabni bitirganim va faqat kollejda oqish mobaynida o'zbek tili bilan do'stlashtirdim (made friends, agar tushunmadingsiz). Menimcha, barcha O'zbekiston maktablarida o'zbek tilini o'qish tili sifatida kiritilish kerak va, balki, rus tilidagi maktablarini yopilish ham, ammo o'zbek maktablarda rus guruhlarini tarkib qilish majbur. Va rus tilini va adabiyotni o'rganish imkoniyat berishni majbur. "Rus sozluvchilar" o'zbek atmosferani faqat shu shartida sezadilar.

Окам (Укам) Узбекчилик шу 11 ийл ичида бизни каерга олиб келган? Узбек ман деб, хамма нарсани Козохстонда сотиб олиб юрубсан, 06 хаидаб, чунки Неxияга пулинг етмиди. Демократия Узбеклардан чикмиди, еки Америка уни Узбекистонга олиб келмаиди. Демократия бизга Россиядан келади, ман масалан Урусларга карши емас ман, уйлиманки бизга купрок Уруслар керак, аттанг Россияга хаммаси кетаяпти. Эртага давлат: "хаммасини осамиз" деиса Узбеклар: "аркони беришадими еки узимиз олиб келамизми" деб суриди. Аттанг бизда шу менталитет бор, куйларга ухшаб кетурамиз "давлатга рахмат, тинчлик, нонимизга пул бор" деб.

[MUHLIS]

Окам (Укам) Узбекчилик шу 11 ийл ичида бизни каерга олиб келган? Узбек ман деб, хамма нарсани Козохстонда сотиб олиб юрубсан, 06 хаидаб, чунки Неxияга пулинг етмиди. Демократия Узбеклардан чикмиди, еки Америка уни Узбекистонга олиб келмаиди. Демократия бизга Россиядан келади, ман масалан Урусларга карши емас ман, уйлиманки бизга купрок Уруслар керак, аттанг Россияга хаммаси кетаяпти. Эртага давлат: "хаммасини осамиз" деиса Узбеклар: "аркони беришадими еки узимиз олиб келамизми" деб суриди. Аттанг бизда шу менталитет бор, куйларга ухшаб кетурамиз "давлатга рахмат, тинчлик, нонимизга пул бор" деб.
Juda ham kizik gap boldiyu a! Ha mayli oz fikringizni ozingiz uchun asrab koying kerak boladi. Ammo biz demokratiya kuramiz baribir

[MUHLIS]

Окам (Укам) Узбекчилик шу 11 ийл ичида бизни каерга олиб келган? Узбек ман деб, хамма нарсани Козохстонда сотиб олиб юрубсан, 06 хаидаб, чунки Неxияга пулинг етмиди. Демократия Узбеклардан чикмиди, еки Америка уни Узбекистонга олиб келмаиди. Демократия бизга Россиядан келади, ман масалан Урусларга карши емас ман, уйлиманки бизга купрок Уруслар керак, аттанг Россияга хаммаси кетаяпти. Эртага давлат: "хаммасини осамиз" деиса Узбеклар: "аркони беришадими еки узимиз олиб келамизми" деб суриди. Аттанг бизда шу менталитет бор, куйларга ухшаб кетурамиз "давлатга рахмат, тинчлик, нонимизга пул бор" деб.
Afsus, men IPni tekchirishni bilmayman.....menimcha men sizni anchadan beri taniyman! Siz uzland.uzni forumida ham bolib turasiz MARDUK lakabi bilan.....agar adashmasam....va albatta u MARDUK ozini kimligina allakachon isbotlagan....unda "Milliy Gurur" degan narsa yok! LEkin men bunga hayron kolmayman chunki siz kabi kishilar uruslar tomonidan "brainwashed" bolgan va ozlarini "russkagavaryashiy" deb hisoblovchi kishilar toifasidansiz. Buning eng yorkin isboti bu sizning kirill alibosida yozganingizdur, ayni chogda.
Vakt oliy hakam, koramiz olmay yursak.

[R:K:K]

Ruslarni hukmronligi shu darajaga etdiki yaqinda bankada ishlayotgan uzbek millatiga mansub banka hodimlarini yuqorining ogzaki buyrugi bilan ishdan bushatib urniga rus millatiga mansub banka sohasidan tamoman behabar bulgan yigit-qizlarni ishga olinayapti va ularga bankada ishlayotgan uzbeklar ish urgatayapti uzlari esa ishdan majburiy ravuishda ishdan bushab ketayaptilar bu holga nima deyish mumkin? BU haromzoda ruslar qachongacha BIZNING OSHIMIZGA PASHA BULIB TUSHADILAR? Kim tuhtatadi bu hunrezliklarni? Hozirgi davlat tepasida utirgan marazlar uzbek halqini bir burda nong zor qildi, ular ruslarning noni eb katta bulgan yalohhurlar edi va halqni ahvolini harop qildi. Oy chiqsa ham ruslarga kun chiqsa ham ularga; qachongacha bu hol davom qiladi?
Siz yo shlar bu holga ham kuz yumib qaraysizlarmi ertaga bir kun uqishni bitkazib Vatanga qaytganlaringizda? Uzlaringiz uylab kuringizlar sizlarni ruslardan nimangiz ekisik? Birisi yozibdi 11 yil nima berdi Uzbekistonga deb? Kommunistik tuzumni noni eganalr bor ekan ahvol bundan yahshi bulishiga hech kim kafolat bermaydi!
U zuluklarni hammsini rahbarlik lavozimlaridan olib tashlash kerak va ular odil sud oldida qilgan insoniylik ayblari uchun jinoiy javobgarlikka tortilishi kerak! CHunki ular qanchadan -qancha begunoh insonlarni uldirib yuborishdi zindonlarga soldilar; ularning boshida utirgan zaharli ilonlarni boshi yanchilishi kerak. Oldin Stalin tuzumi bizning oydin insonlarimizni uldirdi hozir esa................... uldirmoqda, terisini shilib olmoqda, qaynoq suvda pishirmakda, bollarini etim onalarni qamoqqa otmoqda, farzandini kuzi ungida onalarni qip yalongoch qilmoqda, hotinlarini esa erining kuz oldida nomusiga tajavuz etmoqda buni ruslar emas uzimizdan chiqqan manqurtlar qilmoqda! Bazi yigitlar nomusiga chiday olmasdan uzlarini osib yoki uzlariga ut quyib joniga qasd qilmoqda:

[Mehmon]

Dostim Millat Farzandi
sizning yozgan maqolangizni okib chikdim va fikrga keldim,
men sizni bu mavzuga bolgan fikringizni 70-80% foiz kullab kuvatlayman lekin,
shunday rus yigit va kizlar ham borki ular uzbek tilini va madaniyatini zhuda ham hurmat kiladi..
masalan: mening turmush ortogim Moskva shaxridan ozi russ milattiga mansub,
uzbekchani xozirda kerak bolsa usha Uzbekistondagi "ruskogovoryashi" degan kishaliringizdan yaxshi gapiradi.
demak, kop hollarda bizning uzbek halkiga boglik, avvalom bor ozimiz hurmat kilishimiz kerak oz tilimizni, oz madaniyatimizni ana shunda kolgan millat vakillari xurmat kozi bilan karaydi.
"Quote"Uzbeklarni oz ona tilisida rus sozlarini ishlatishi, har bir 2 sozdan keyin,
xorosho, davay, da, net, voobshe kabi zolarni.. bu madaniyatsizlikka kiradi"

rahmat etiborlaring uchun
:arrow:

[Kolobok]

Здравствуйте уважаемые участники форума...
Миллат Фарзанди,извини но я на столько рассердился,что еле здерживаю себя...Ты чего против русских имееш? Где бы ты сидел и какое состояние было бы если бы русские не пришли в Среднюю Азию?Ты думаешь,что Узбекистан был-бы более развит чем сейчас? Если ты на самом деле так думаешь,то ты глубоко ошибаешся...Если бы Русские не захватили наше государство,мы бы наверника жили бы как в Афганистане,война между ханствами до сих пор существовала бы!
Вот тебе один вопрос,кто работает на заводах, на больших заводах как Навоинский горнометалургический комбинат(состовляет почти половину бюджета Узбекистана),Азот и так далее? Русские! Узбек там в жизни не сможет работать...он вытащит всё оттуда и продаст на базаре...И вообще такого трудолюбивого народа как Русские,не существует!
Теперь еще одно,все министры и все такие крутые которые сидят на креслах государства все Узбеки и.тд Знаешь почему?Потому,что русские не воруют как наши и не дают воровать другим.
Если возможно,надо какого-нибудь толкового русского посадить на пост государственного советника Узбекистана...я уверен всё будет иначе.
Будут вопросы,спрашивай

[XSpider]

Здравствуйте уважаемые участники форума...
Миллат Фарзанди,извини но я на столько рассердился,что еле здерживаю себя...Ты чего против русских имееш? Где бы ты сидел и какое состояние было бы если бы русские не пришли в Среднюю Азию?Ты думаешь,что Узбекистан был-бы более развит чем сейчас? Если ты на самом деле так думаешь,то ты глубоко ошибаешся...Если бы Русские не захватили наше государство,мы бы наверника жили бы как в Афганистане,война между ханствами до сих пор существовала бы!
Вот тебе один вопрос,кто работает на заводах, на больших заводах как Навоинский горнометалургический комбинат(состовляет почти половину бюджета Узбекистана),Азот и так далее? Русские! Узбек там в жизни не сможет работать...он вытащит всё оттуда и продаст на базаре...И вообще такого трудолюбивого народа как Русские,не существует!
Теперь еще одно,все министры и все такие крутые которые сидят на креслах государства все Узбеки и.тд Знаешь почему?Потому,что русские не воруют как наши и не дают воровать другим.
Если возможно,надо какого-нибудь толкового русского посадить на пост государственного советника Узбекистана...я уверен всё будет иначе.
Будут вопросы,спрашивай
Никогда не выражайтесь яснее, чем вы думаете
:P

Здравствуйте уважаемые участники форума...
Миллат Фарзанди,извини но я на столько рассердился,что еле здерживаю себя...Ты чего против русских имееш? Где бы ты сидел и какое состояние было бы если бы русские не пришли в Среднюю Азию?Ты думаешь,что Узбекистан был-бы более развит чем сейчас? Если ты на самом деле так думаешь,то ты глубоко ошибаешся...Если бы Русские не захватили наше государство,мы бы наверника жили бы как в Афганистане,война между ханствами до сих пор существовала бы!
Вот тебе один вопрос,кто работает на заводах, на больших заводах как Навоинский горнометалургический комбинат(состовляет почти половину бюджета Узбекистана),Азот и так далее? Русские! Узбек там в жизни не сможет работать...он вытащит всё оттуда и продаст на базаре...И вообще такого трудолюбивого народа как Русские,не существует!
Теперь еще одно,все министры и все такие крутые которые сидят на креслах государства все Узбеки и.тд Знаешь почему?Потому,что русские не воруют как наши и не дают воровать другим.
Если возможно,надо какого-нибудь толкового русского посадить на пост государственного советника Узбекистана...я уверен всё будет иначе.
Будут вопросы,спрашивай

Za vot takoy naglost ya i imeyu chto ta protiv kalabok!

[Dollar]

Нимага Узбекистондаги катта заводларда Совет даври вактида булганидек хозир хам рус ва русий забон фукаролар ишлашади? нимага узбеклардан йук? Хурматли "Миллат Фарзанди" балки сиз айтиб берарсиз? Нима учун купгина Банклар ёки чет эл фирмалардида русий забон фукаролар ишга олинади? Мени фикрим шундаки, рус тилида укитиладиган мактабларда билим бериш савийаси кучлик, Институт ёки Университетларда хам худди шундай, Рус миллатига мансуб булган Ота - Оналар уз фарзандларига уларни укиш савийасига узбекларга караганда купрок эътибор беришади. Бирор техника бузилиб колса купрок рус усталарига боришади, чунку улар Узбек уста акаларга караганда анча xалол ишлашади. Заводларда хам худди шу аxвол, куп ватандошлар ишга киришса дарров уйига бирор нарсани олиб кетишга харакат килишади, темирми, тахтами, курук кетиш керак эмасда, русларда буни кузатмаганман. Шифохоналарда хам рус миллатига мансуб докторлар бизникиларга караганда анча хурматта, чунки яна уша ахвол, беморларга яxши карашади ва медицина билими узбек докторлариникига караганда кучлик. Россияни ёмонлаш жудаям модага кирган. Англия Хиндистон ва куп Африка давлатларини босиб олган, хуш, нима ва канака яxшилик олиб келди? Руслар Урта Осиёга келишларидан олдин минтакада тер кассалиги ва яна хар хил инфексия кассаликлари куп булган. Русларни бу минтакани босиб олганларидан кейин позитив тарафлари куп. Кассаликларни купчилигни йук килишди. Дунёдаги адабиёт рус тили оркали кириб келди, фан - теxника ривожланди, одамларни яшаш ахволи анча юкорига чикди, ёш болалар улими камайди. Тошкентни хам Замонавий шахар килган Россиялик инженерлар булади. Мен айтмокчи булганим агар Россияни урнида бошка давлат булганида (албатта, агар руслар босиб олмаса хитойлар ёки инглизлар босиб олган булишарди) бундай хаёт хеч качон курмаган булардик. 70 йил Совет даври нима берди? буни яxшиси ота оналаримиздан сурайлик, Совет Иттифоки булишини хохлайсизми деб суралса катталарди 95% албатта Xа деб жавоб беришади, колган 5% бу Xокимлар, уларга хозир хам ёмон эмас, хаёт. Руслар унака, бунака, узбекча гапирмайди дейишни урнига менимча бошка керакли проблемаларни хал килиш керак, агар шу руслар булмаса Навоий Вилоятидаги барча заводлар, Тошкентдаги катта завод фабрикалар, хаммаси тухтаб колади, чунки Биз узбек ёшлари Экономист, Юрист, Дипломат, Милиционер, Таможниячи, Соликчи ёки Xоким булишни озру киламиз, бирорта ёш йигит Олмалик заводида рабочий булиб ишласам демайди (руслардан ташкари).

[MUHLIS]

Dollar,
Koyilman sizga! Kam bolmang. Sizlarini boringizga shukr. Siz ancha tiyrak fikrli inson ekansiz....Siz juda ham orinli savollarni ortaga tashladingiz....Keling birodar shularga birgalikda javob izlaylik! Birgalikda hakarakat kilaylik!

[Alouddin]

Здравствуйте уважаемые участники форума...
Миллат Фарзанди,извини но я на столько рассердился,что еле здерживаю себя...Ты чего против русских имееш? Где бы ты сидел и какое состояние было бы если бы русские не пришли в Среднюю Азию?Ты думаешь,что Узбекистан был-бы более развит чем сейчас? Если ты на самом деле так думаешь,то ты глубоко ошибаешся...Если бы Русские не захватили наше государство,мы бы наверника жили бы как в Афганистане,война между ханствами до сих пор существовала бы!
Вот тебе один вопрос,кто работает на заводах, на больших заводах как Навоинский горнометалургический комбинат(состовляет почти половину бюджета Узбекистана),Азот и так далее? Русские! Узбек там в жизни не сможет работать...он вытащит всё оттуда и продаст на базаре...И вообще такого трудолюбивого народа как Русские,не существует!
Теперь еще одно,все министры и все такие крутые которые сидят на креслах государства все Узбеки и.тд Знаешь почему?Потому,что русские не воруют как наши и не дают воровать другим.
Если возможно,надо какого-нибудь толкового русского посадить на пост государственного советника Узбекистана...я уверен всё будет иначе.
Будут вопросы,спрашивай

nachit, Будут вопросы, спрашивать??? est vopros, sprashivayu: tebya spellingu russkogo yazyka gde-nibud uchili?..

just curious, Observer

[Kolobok]

Za vot takoy naglost ya i imeyu chto ta protiv kalabok!
Za kakuyu eshe naglost'?!?! :?
Dollar,fully agree with u...About Navoi region,i've never been there..but i've heard that it's been called as a second Leningrad or Small Leningrad,which was architected by russian architects and russians are the ones who descovered gold,Uranium and other natural resourses in this region...The same with Fergana's Azot Factory,which was also built by russians.
About teachers,97% of my teachers were russians,they rule...And i'm really greatfull to my teachers. :)
Kolobo4ek ;)

Shu kunlarda Uzb.da bank ishlariga zudlik bilan uzbeklarni bushatib urniga evropa millatiga mansub ayollarni olishayotgan ekan. Uzini tanishtirmagan manbalarni aytishiga karaganda may oyida jahon bankini majlisi tishkentda utishi munosabati bilan kelgan mehmonlar uzbek banklarida evropa irkidagi hodimlar ishlamas ekan degan fikrga bormasligi uchun ekan. (source:ozodlik radiosi)

Bunga nima deysiz millat farzandi?

[Kolobok]

Observer, da uchili,but i've never worked hard on it.
And ur question is out of theme,as usual.

[Alouddin]

Observer, da uchili, but i've never worked hard on it.
And ur question is out of theme, as usual.

hehe, out of theme nima degani o'zi? :D mabodo off topic emasmi? :D God! nicho, sanam kotta bo'larsan ;)

if you were taught the spelling but never paid attention to it, then I believe you are showing disrespect by violating the language norms... a esho zastupaeshsa... :rolleyes:

you are gonna be a big guy some day...

Observer

[Kolobok]

Observer,maybe 'm showin' disrespect as u've mentioned above,but is that ur bussines? Well,if u r tryin' to annoy me,say so. I don't really care about it. :)

[Alouddin]

Observer,maybe 'm showin' disrespect as u've mentioned above,but is that ur bussines? Well,if u r tryin' to annoy me,say so. I don't really care about it. :)

ndah... annoy me, degin?.. o'zbeklarda bitta yaxshi gap bor: boshim kal, ko'nglim nozik, degan... yoki, notavon ko'ngilga qo'tir jomashov...

ma'nosini o'zing chiqarib olarsan... omon bo'gin... Kalaboq :D

[Kolobok]

o'zbeklarda bitta yaxshi gap bor: boshim kal, ko'nglim nozik, degan... yoki, notavon ko'ngilga qo'tir jomashov...
Sorry man,i didn't get it at all...excuse my uzb.And it's not Koloboq it's Kolobok,plz don't mix it :P

[Alouddin]

o'zbeklarda bitta yaxshi gap bor: boshim kal, ko'nglim nozik, degan... yoki, notavon ko'ngilga qo'tir jomashov...
Sorry man,i didn't get it at all...excuse my uzb.And it's not Koloboq it's Kolobok,plz don't mix it :P

nima umuman o'zbek tilini bilmisanmi??? :shock: umuman arosatda qolibsanku, ukajon... russian spelling sux bo'sa, inglish yeli-yeli bo'sa... o'zbek vafshe ni panimayt bo'sen...

ndaaaaa :shock:

Za vot takoy naglost ya i imeyu chto ta protiv kalabok!
Za kakuyu eshe naglost'?!?! :?
Dollar,fully agree with u...About Navoi region,i've never been there..but i've heard that it's been called as a second Leningrad or Small Leningrad,which was architected by russian architects and russians are the ones who descovered gold,Uranium and other natural resourses in this region...The same with Fergana's Azot Factory,which was also built by russians.
About teachers,97% of my teachers were russians,they rule...And i'm really greatfull to my teachers. :)
Kolobo4ek ;)
Kalabk, kel oradagi okibatni kochirmagin uka, avval his-hayajonni yigishtirib boshkattan okib chik yozganlarimni! Kelajakda diplomat boladigan bolasan! Diplomat bolish uchun English kerak bolishiga akling yetibdi...endi yana bittasiga ham akilingni ishlatib yuborsang uzakka borasan ;) Yahshi bolasan sen, lekin.

[Alouddin]

Kalabk, kel oradagi okibatni kochirmagin uka, avval his-hayajonni yigishtirib boshkattan okib chik yozganlarimni! Kelajakda diplomat boladigan bolasan! Diplomat bolish uchun English kerak bolishiga akling yetibdi...endi yana bittasiga ham akilingni ishlatib yuborsang uzakka borasan ;) Yahshi bolasan sen, lekin.

:D :D :D :D :D :D ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

[Dollar]

Узбек халки масалн япон ёки корея милларлари сингари ишга булган мадинияти йук. Албатта дехкончилик ота-бобомиздан колган, паxта булса биздан утадигани йук. Айтмокчи булганим, ишга булган маданиятни кучайтириш керак. Кореяга бориб ишлаётган огайниларни курсам роса хурсанд буламан, бир вактлари Совет даврида, мактаб-техникумлардан студентларни практикага Москвадаги Горкий Заводига 2 ойдан олиб кетишарди, хозир Москва булмасаям шу Корея сингари давлатларга жунатиш керак, Миллат Фарзданди, сиз мендан "Нима учун Асакадаги заводда узбеклар ишлаябди, нима улар одаммасми ? " деб савол бермадингиз ;) , Айтмокчи булганим заводдаги ёшларни купчилиг узбек ва улар Кореяда ишлаб келишган. Факат худди шу йул билан миллий, малакали ишчиларни олса булади, Теxникумларни хозир Колледж деб номини алмаштиришган ва куп жойларда станок билан ишлайдиган касб фанларини урнига шу экономика бухгалтерияларни купайтириб юборишган, бошкаттан куриб чикилса яxши буларди, иложиси булса Мактаб 10-11 укувчиларини Узбекистондаги катта завод, Фаргонадаги Азот, Нефти кайта ишлаш заводи, Оламалик, Бекободдаги заводларга практикага жунатиш керак, зора кизикиш пайдо булса. Теxника фанларига купрок этибор бериш керак, чет элда укиётган ёшлар 50% экономист булса колгани сиёсат, дипломатия, шу инжинерлик буйича хам грантлар берилса зур буларди. Кизиктириш керакда, айникса кишлокдаги йигитларни :) , шахардагилар хеч качон боришмиди заводга :) , Алохида Давлат микёсида сиоёсат утказиш керак узбек ёшларини завод фабрикаларда ишга чакиргани,

[Dollar]

Za vot takoy naglost ya i imeyu chto ta protiv kalabok!
Za kakuyu eshe naglost'?!?! :?
Dollar,fully agree with u...About Navoi region,i've never been there..but i've heard that it's been called as a second Leningrad or Small Leningrad,which was architected by russian architects and russians are the ones who descovered gold,Uranium and other natural resourses in this region...The same with Fergana's Azot Factory,which was also built by russians.
About teachers,97% of my teachers were russians,they rule...And i'm really greatfull to my teachers. :)
Kolobo4ek ;)

by the way, name "Navoi" also given by russian minister from Moscow, I cannot remember name, but he used love literature, izza etogo govorjat on krome Navoi nazval nekotorye bolshye zavody CCCR imeni Lomonosova, Pushkina, Tarasa Bulba, vse svjazanny s uranom i drugimi red.metalami. Takoi interesny byl okazyvaeta :) , ya eto chital 4 goda nazad "Komsomolskoi Pravde" a to chto gorod Navoi byl postroen po planu goroda Leningrad eto pravda, tak i bylo, no govoryat chto uzhe vid pochti isportili, otdali zemlyu novostrojkam a tam uzhe bez plana postroili doma s samanami (loi gishtdan, pashali, ajvonli ujlar) i vot tebe Leningrad :)

[Western]

Togrisini aitganda buerdagi kopchilik kishilar akli kalta, savodsiz kishilar boshka larga hurmat yok ularda.
masalan oddiy misol, buerda gap nima togrisida ketiyaptiyu ularni tortishgan mavzusini karang,,,
mundok olib karaganda shular endi Uzbekistonimizni " qobiliyatli eshlari" shuda.. huh? :( ...
bunday kishilar bor ekan oramizda vatanimzda deyarli kozga korinadigan ozgarishlar bolishiga ishonch yok..
yani bir bor aytib otaman,, hamma emas.. ba`zi bir "kishilar" ozlari manimcha
korib turibdilar..
eh usha molokosos patcanlar...
undan kora ilm organ buerda tortishib ozingni madaniyatsizligingi korsatmasdan.

If you have any questions regarding this message please let me know.. I`ll be willing to make clear myself on this issue.

rahmat

[spoon]

Observer, да ладно тебе. может ето у него стилистика такая.
вообще, вам нужно сейчас по http://smilies.sofrayt.com/%5E/g0/beer.gif

Salom Muhlis,
Juda uzin voqt utapti ko'rishmay yurgali.siz juda ahmayatli masalani o'rtaga toshlagan.afsus forum maqolalaridan ko'rinip turiptiki,Uzbek ziyolilari orasida birlik kamchil.hatto bazida birar masila uchin o'z-ora hafa bulip uriship ketishdan yonmaydi.bu ziyolilarning o'broziga yot bir holattir."har kimlar nema daydi,g'erip bo'lganni bilmaydi"deganday,har kim o'z maqomig'a bir nemalarni to'vlaydi.bu balkim biz Uyghur va Uzbaklarning mijaz-haroktiradiki(pishologiyasidaki)ojizliq ham bizni buginki binormol oqivatlarga olip kelgan tuginli sabab esa kerak.
balkim silarning hoziringlar bizning atamizdir.odam o'zini -o'zi sevmasa.o'zini o'zi hurmatlamasa oqivat uni hichkim hisopqa olmaydi.o'z milli hosliqimizni jon tikib qo'gdash biz millat parzandlarining bosh tortib bo'lmaydiya masuliyitidur.
mayli har hil pikirlarning zohid bulip turishiga kang qo'rsoqliq bilan muomila qilish kerak,lekin uzini Uzbek dep otig'ichi har bir millat parzandi millilk masalasida birlikka kilashi .chong ishlar oldada kichik datolashlar ustada zig'irlop ketmaslagi kerak dep o'yloyman.bulmasa chong ittipoqsizlik kelip chiqadi,millatni ziyolilar qutqozmisa kim qutqizadi?ziyolilar o'rtasida birlik,inoqlik bulmasa bu ishlarni kim ro'yopka chiqiradi?
hush qoling.
hurmat ela,
do'stingiz Uyghuri

[Siege]

Millat Farzandi, Muhlis I've read all postings here.
Can I call you Жумавой now on?
Or just фарзанд (child)?

Call him Millat Fureri

[Alouddin]

Observer, да ладно тебе. может ето у него стилистика такая.
вообще, вам нужно сейчас по http://smilies.sofrayt.com/%5E/g0/beer.gif

:x-mas: :king: :bday: obyazatel'no uchtu :D no! ya ne pyu piva, tak sho vot eto vot =>:proost:<= toka pri uslovii, sho eto kola ili esho kakaya-nit drugaya soda :D

khm, I am talking off the topic, so I stop right here :)

Wassalam, Observer

p/s Koloboq buys the soda :drinking:

Me, HabJII-ODaTEJIb

[KOLOBOKKA]

KO'PROQ KITOB O'QIB, TANQIDIY FIRK YURITISHGA O'RGANING.
FIKRLARINGIZNI HURMAT QILAMAN, LEKIN ENG MUHIMI GAPLARINGIZDAGI MANTIQDADIR...

[Female] Guest --MAGDALENA

[Kolobok]

Хоп булади :)

[Qurbonoy]

Biz qachongacha uzga millatni madaniyatli uz millatimizni madaniyatsiz deb kamsitib yashaymiz? Nahotki usha YApon yoki Koresdan bizning nimamiz kam, bizda ishlahsga sharoit yuq holos! Bizning ishcilarimiz oylab ishlashadi lekin maoshning yuzini bila kurmmaydi, Usha siz maqtayotgan va sizning nazaringizda uta madaniyatli YApon yoki Koresni ish haqini tulamang-chi, ular bir kun ishlarmikan? Hozir Evropada bir soat ish haqi oddiygina telvizor tuzatadigan ustaning 5o$ . Endi bizdachi? Uylab kuring yahshilab siz ustaga 50$ emas ategi 25$ bering u qanaqa ish qilarkin bir kuring keyin "madaniyat" haqida lof yozing. Usha zavod yoki fabrikada ishlaydigan usta oyiga qancha oylik oladi Uzbekistonda? Evropada malakali usta oyiga 5000-6000$ hisobida oylik oladi. Vrachlar eshitishimga Uzbekistonda 10$ olarkan! Kulguli raqam tugrimi? YAponiyada-chi yaki uta madaniyatli deb baholayotganingiz Koreada-chi vrachlar qancha oladi bir oy ishlab? Evropada bitta vrach 5000$ atrofida oylik oladi. Bunga nima deysiz uz halqini madaniyatsizlikda ayblayotgan hurmatli janob? Siz agar shu kayfiyatda bulsangiz uz halqingizga nisbatan ishqilib insonlarning kuni sizga qolmasin-da, Hatto Rossiyadagi ishchi yoki vrachham bizdagilar kabi hurlanmasa kerak?
Bu nima degan gap hatto Medinistitutning studentlari uch oylab pahtaga borishadi ahir ularning qulida-ku, bizning taqdirimiz? Bular haqida ham chuqurroq uyladingizmi?

[muhlisni mulisi]

Millat Farzandi, Muhlis I've read all postings here.
Can I call you Жумавой now on?
Or just фарзанд (child)?
poor siege he has nothing to say
he can only attack personalities
come on boy grow up

"farzand" is not a child
go and improve your uzbek

to student
sndaqa ahmoq ozbeklar hamma yogni rasvoini chiqarib tashlashdi

[SayFuLLoH]

Vsyo kogdato zakanchivaetca,budem nadeyatca!:-)

Millat Farzandi, Muhlis I've read all postings here.
Can I call you Жумаво?now on?
Or just фарзан?(child)?

Are you an idiot?

[Free]

Kakaya raznitsa imeet chto russkiye nad nami kontroliruet.Esli russkiye uydut pridut Amerikantsy ili Evropeytsi.

Kakaya raznitsa imeet chto russkiye nad nami kontroliruet.Esli russkiye uydut pridut Amerikantsy ili Evropeytsi.
I disagee, prove what you said.

Всех узкомыслящих националистов попрошу заткнутся и почетать статью что ниже, даётся краткий вариант:

Завершился конкурс "Эрудит информационных технологий"

Uzreport.com. Опубликовано 03.03.2003 11:32


1 марта состоялся заключительный этап конкурса по программированию среди студентов Ташкентского государственного технического университета (ТГТУ) на призы Республиканского фонда по поддержке одаренной молодежи "Улугбек".

Целями конкурса были демонстрация потенциала узбекской молодежи и стимулирование наиболее талантливых ее представителей. Однако, как отметил генеральный директор Фонда "Улугбек" и председатель жюри Жасур Салихов, конкурс этим не ограничивался. Его долгосрочной целью является разработка механизмов поддержки талантливых программистов, в частности, создание в стране молодежных творческих коллективов и привлечение их к участию в различных проектах, включая международные.

Победителем конкурса стал студент магистратуры ТГТУ Шегай Алексей. Второе место занял первокурсник Шаврин Артем. Третье место поделили Казаев Евгений (4 курс), Элин Евгений (3 курс), Абдурашидов Нурмухаммад (3 курс), Граница Константин (4 курс) и Крупчинский Антон (студент 3 курса академического лицея).



Shuning uchun millatchilik bilan shugullanishdan oldin, ruslardan bizga tegishi mumkin bo'lgan foydani ham o'ylanglar! Eh, vi...

[Free]

I disagee, prove what you said.

Ty podojdi nemnojko i uvidesh eto sam.

I disagee, prove what you said.

Ty podojdi nemnojko i uvidesh eto sam.
Do refer to me in russian.

[f ®]

nice topic mutafekkir,

but I would change the title of the topic to the "why has the law on state language not been enforced in UZ ?" or smth like that. I do not think that there is any "russian" dominance in uzbek cities, besides they are very uzbeks (I mean uzbek citizens) and any title about "russian" domination over uzbek cities could be misunderstood. As for the issue - fully agree with it. There must be more investments to development of uzbek language, quality translations.


P.S. to Dollar: all factories you mentioned were built to exploit treasures of Uzbekistan, it was morally criminal policy of Moscow, which in fact profited from Uzbek gold selling abroad. Uzbekistan in soviet period knew nothing about how much gold was mined and sold, it was a factory under Moscow's management - poor colonial policy.

Uzbeks can work in factories & they do their job much better then workers in Russia, most of whom are alcoholics. Uz-daewoo project is a good example (in regard of performance of uzbek workers). Admit it, uzbeks are the most hardworking people of all nations of the former soviet union.

[trigger-happy]

Uzbeks can work in factories & they do their job much better then workers in Russia, most of whom are alcoholics. Uz-daewoo project is a good example (in regard of performance of uzbek workers). Admit it, uzbeks are the most hardworking people of all nations of the former soviet union.
You're kidding, right? From what I hear, UzDaewoo is a disaster.

[MUHLIS]

Uzbeks can work in factories & they do their job much better then workers in Russia, most of whom are alcoholics. Uz-daewoo project is a good example (in regard of performance of uzbek workers). Admit it, uzbeks are the most hardworking people of all nations of the former soviet union.
You're kidding, right? From what I hear, UzDaewoo is a disaster.
What you hear is not necessarily what it is.

[trigger-happy]

And you, I suppose, have a first-hand knowledge? ;)

[MUHLIS]

And you, I suppose, have a first-hand knowledge? ;)
No I did not say that. But do not be so passionate about defending russians...it is well known that they are alkaholiks, of course not all of them but majority of them.... ;)

[f ®]

Uzbeks can work in factories & they do their job much better then workers in Russia, most of whom are alcoholics. Uz-daewoo project is a good example (in regard of performance of uzbek workers). Admit it, uzbeks are the most hardworking people of all nations of the former soviet union.
You're kidding, right? From what I hear, UzDaewoo is a disaster.

triggerhappy, again you have comprehension problems, the point here is performance of uzbek workers in UzDaewoo, not about the factory. Remember, what some russians used to say "uzbeks can never work in factories, only what uzbek can do is to work in cotton plantations". And what you see - uzbeks managed to create a new industry, where uzbek workers produce cars with quality, besides UzDaewoo is the Nr.1 in Russia among foreign car exporters. It's ironic, but russians prefer cars like matiz, nexia done by "uzbek, who will never learn how to handle a screw driver".

triggerhappy, again you have comprehension problems, the point here is performance of uzbek workers in UzDaewoo, not about the factory. Remember, what some russians used to say "uzbeks can never work in factories, only what uzbek can do is to work in cotton plantations". And what you see - uzbeks managed to create a new industry, where uzbek workers produce cars with quality, besides UzDaewoo is the Nr.1 in Russia among foreign car exporters. It's ironic, but russians prefer cars like matiz, nexia done by "uzbek, who will never learn how to handle a screw driver".
Again, instead of accusing me of being dumb (you were nice enough to put it as "comprehension problems"), you should have not made any dumb comments. (Namely: "Uzbeks are the most hardworking people of former Soviet Union") Although I have never had the honor of knowing any factory workers, I am sure Uzbek workers are not fundamentally different from Russian, Korean, etc. But to call one nation the most hardworking is just plain stupid - Uzbeks are not one homogenous mass: some are lazy, wasting their time on fourm.uz, and some are hardworking. If Uzbeks were the most hardworking nation, as you put it, UzDaewoo cars would be built much better and cost much cheaper. I have seen Uzbek people working in non-factory settings - doctors, teachers, office workers. And their work ethic was average - not better, not worse.
P.S. Seems that insulting someone in a public forum is a true measure of intelligence and good upbringing. (for f(R) at least)

[f ®]

Again, instead of accusing me of being dumb (you were nice enough to put it as "comprehension problems"), you should have not made any dumb comments. (Namely: "Uzbeks are the most hardworking people of former Soviet Union") Although I have never had the honor of knowing any factory workers, I am sure Uzbek workers are not fundamentally different from Russian, Korean, etc. But to call one nation the most hardworking is just plain stupid - Uzbeks are not one homogenous mass: some are lazy, wasting their time on fourm.uz, and some are hardworking. If Uzbeks were the most hardworking nation, as you put it, UzDaewoo cars would be built much better and cost much cheaper. I have seen Uzbek people working in non-factory settings - doctors, teachers, office workers. And their work ethic was average - not better, not worse.
P.S. Seems that insulting someone in a public forum is a true measure of intelligence and good upbringing. (for f(R) at least)

trigger-happy, I didn't call you dumb, you did it yourself :) and it's not "dumb comment" to call uzbeks the most hardworking. Besides it's not my words, but what I hear from people of other natiolities in regard to uzbeks. In comparison to other nationalities uzbeks tend to be the most hardworking, and nothing wrong with that.

As for work ethic of doctors etc. - well russians or russian-speakers were privilaged in education, every liturature was in russian, doctors or specialists were russians. It's understandable that non-russian speakers would not get the same education as russian-speakers. Provided the same conditions and opportunities uzbeks are not the last to others, maybe better then others ;)

P.S. do not take every word as insult, babe ;)

[trigger-happy]

do not take every word as insult, babe ;)
I won't if you don't call me babe ;)

As for your argument about doctors, it seems perfectly valid to me. But what about firemen? My dad used to work in Turkiston concert hall in Tashkent and they had firemen on staff who were supposed to make sure noone smoked and fire safety was observed at all times. What they did you wouldn't belive but I saw it with my own eyes: smoking and drinking on the job, and they cooked osh on open fire (uchoq) - indoors! Firemen! Now I don't care what language their fireman textbooks were in - this stuff is common sense. You don't cook with open fire indoors in a simple hut - let alone a brand-new, multi-million concert hall. I don't care if you are Uzbek, Russian, or Venezuelan, this is not good work ethic.

I hope to God factory workers are better, cause my parents drive Nexias.

well, as for being drunk - it's not very common among uzbeks. If there drinking became a part of uzbeks evereday life, it is because of the influence of russian culture on uzbeks ;)

in the same opportunities uzbeks, as said, before are not worse then any others.

[k]

I think attacking particular nation or nationality is quite racist view. there is no such thing as uzbek can do better than russian or korean etc. it is all bound to your ability and willingness to do the job. Presense of russians & russian language gave us a lot of knowledge and greater access to world. so why 'attack' them rather than learning from them where approprite.

[MUHLIS]

Shu kunlarda Uzb.da bank ishlariga zudlik bilan uzbeklarni bushatib urniga evropa millatiga mansub ayollarni olishayotgan ekan. Uzini tanishtirmagan manbalarni aytishiga karaganda may oyida jahon bankini majlisi tishkentda utishi munosabati bilan kelgan mehmonlar uzbek banklarida evropa irkidagi hodimlar ishlamas ekan degan fikrga bormasligi uchun ekan. (source:ozodlik radiosi)

Bunga nima deysiz millat farzandi?
Men "ozini tanitisahni istamagan" "manba'larga" ishonmayman!

[R:K.K.]

Men "ozini tanitisahni istamagan" "manba'larga" ishonmayman!


_________________
Millat farzandi siz qanaqa" millat farzandisiz" bu haqda ahir rdiolarda qancha gapirishdi, banka hodimlari interviyu berishdi "Ozolik" radiosini nazarda tutayapman nahotki siz kabi "Millat farzandi" deya uziga nom bergan deyarli bir insonni; bu habarni eshitmasligi odamni tajubga soladi?! Siz uzingizni haqiqqiy millat farzandi deb bilsangiz bu habarni eshitishingiz va uzingiz bu masalani kutrishingiz kerak edi?! Bulmasa nima qilasiz bunaqa deb uzingizga nom tanlab: oddiygina ALI-mi, Vali-mi, bulaqoling! Siz birinchi postingizda suhbatni Ismoil Gasparalidan boshladingiz aminmanki siz ALF ARSLON TURKASHdan ham habaringiz bor cunki ul ulug zot uzin uni shogirdi ularoq qabul qiladi. Tom manoda milliyatchi bulmoq istasangiz Turon zamini tarihini yahshi bilmoqingiz kerak va hozirgi paytdagi siyosiy uyinlardan ham yahshi habordor bulishingiz kerak. YAna bir marta uylab kuring?!

[MUHLIS]

Men "ozini tanitisahni istamagan" "manba'larga" ishonmayman!


_________________
Millat farzandi siz qanaqa" millat farzandisiz" bu haqda ahir rdiolarda qancha gapirishdi, banka hodimlari interviyu berishdi "Ozolik" radiosini nazarda tutayapman nahotki siz kabi "Millat farzandi" deya uziga nom bergan deyarli bir insonni; bu habarni eshitmasligi odamni tajubga soladi?! Siz uzingizni haqiqqiy millat farzandi deb bilsangiz bu habarni eshitishingiz va uzingiz bu masalani kutrishingiz kerak edi?! Bulmasa nima qilasiz bunaqa deb uzingizga nom tanlab: oddiygina ALI-mi, Vali-mi, bulaqoling! Siz birinchi postingizda suhbatni Ismoil Gasparalidan boshladingiz aminmanki siz ALF ARSLON TURKASHdan ham habaringiz bor cunki ul ulug zot uzin uni shogirdi ularoq qabul qiladi. Tom manoda milliyatchi bulmoq istasangiz Turon zamini tarihini yahshi bilmoqingiz kerak va hozirgi paytdagi siyosiy uyinlardan ham yahshi habordor bulishingiz kerak. YAna bir marta uylab kuring?!
Siz nima demoqchi bo'lganingizni yahshi angladim deb o'ylayman. Agar e'tibor bergan bo'lsangiz, men "Millat Farzandi" tahallusni olishimga hali erta ekanini anglab yetib, uni ko'rib turganingiz tahallusga alishtirdim....
Sizning insoniy va siyosiy qarashlaringizdan va sizning shahsiyatingizdan mening yahshi habarim yok, masalan. Shuning uchun men siz aytgan har qanday fikrni to'gri yoki notog'ri ekanini, va hamda samimiylik bilanmi yoki g'arazgo'ylik bilanmi aytilayotgani haqida o'ylayman....Siz yana ko'nglizngizga olmang bu gaplarimni, unuman istalgan notanish kishi haqida shunday fikrga borish mumkin...Nazarimda, huddi anashu mantiqni "maba'lar"ga ham taqasa bo'ladi. albatta shahsan men, mustaqil bit Mamlakat farzandi sifatida, qanday tashkilot bo'lishidan qat'iy nazar, bizning ichki ishlarimizga burun tiqishlarini holisona kuzata olmayman....Ammo, bundan avval menda boshqa savol paydo bo'ladi, nega endi men "o'zini tanitishni istamagan manba'ga" ishonishim kerak? Men nima bolmokchi ekanimni tushunyapsizmi?
Endi osha "habarni" "Nemis Ovozi"(?) (uzr aniq esimda yok oti) tarqatayotganiga kelsak, buni har tomonlama izohlash mumkin, lekin albatta ular Uzbek millatiga qayg'urganlari bois ushbu habarni taqatishgan deya olmaymiz, to'g'rimi?

[R:K:K]

"Sizning insoniy va siyosiy qarashlaringizdan va sizning shahsiyatingizdan mening yahshi habarim yok, masalan. Shuning uchun men siz aytgan har qanday fikrni to'gri yoki notog'ri ekanini, va hamda samimiylik bilanmi yoki g'arazgo'ylik bilanmi aytilayotgani haqida o'ylayman....Siz yana ko'nglizngizga olmang bu gaplarimni, unuman istalgan notanish kishi haqida shunday fikrga borish "


Hurmatli Mutafakkir yozganingizni uqidim ochiqi mening kulgum keldi :D negaki siz meni "allaqanday garazguy" niyatda yozilgan deb qabul qilayotganga uhshaysiz,
meni kechiring mening hech qanady niyatim ham yuq siz uz Vataningizni qancha sevsangiz men ham sizdan kam sevmayman, siz qancha Rus bosqinchilaridan nafratlansangiz men ham shuncha nafratlanaman. CHunki ruslar bizning tarihimizni sohtalashtirishdi u ham etmaganday millatimiznin asl farzandlarini yo dorga oshishdi, yoki turmalarda qiynab uldirishdi. Buni yozmasam ham mutafakkir sifatida yahshi bilasiz tarihimzning qon bilan sugorilgan varaqlarini?! Endi bu habarni tarqatgan "Nemis Volnasi" emas "Ozodlik" radiosi, hatto muhbir usha bankda ishlaydigan bir kizdan interviyu ham oldi. Bu habarni eshitmagan bulishingiz tabiiy naegaki siz eshitmagan bilan bu habarni minglab radio muhlislari eshitishdi!

Endi osha "habarni" "Nemis Ovozi"(?) (uzr aniq esimda yok oti) tarqatayotganiga kelsak, buni har tomonlama izohlash mumkin, lekin albatta ular Uzbek millatiga qayg'urganlari bois ushbu habarni taqatishgan deya olmaymiz, to'g'rimi?


E usha radio aynan uzbek halqiga hizmat qilishi uchun ochilgan-ku, nima unga ham shubhangiz bormi? Tugri menga ishonmasligingizni men tugri qabul qilaman chunki siz meni yahshi tanimaysiz mendanshubhalanishga haqqingiz bor lekin radio u boshqa masala! Tugri mamlakatimiz mustaqil buni hech kim inkor qilmaydi.
Mutafakkir sizga omad yor bulsin!

[Eichmann]

Sieg Heil, janob Mudakfakkir!
I have recently noted the way you ware your tie. Tell me, do you want to throttle yourself? Yout should better learn how to make a good knot on your tie before placing your picture here. Or hang the badge “Uzbekistan uber alles!!!” instead.

[trigger-happy]

Making fun of a man's tie. Classy. C'mon, we are discussing ideas here! I'd love to hear your idea on the topic itself, not fashion tips for MUHLIS.

Mutafakkir, Or Muhlis(same thing).
What the hell you want? Ok, russians always used to f@@k us, so? What can we do about it? And, wasn't that f@@k a pleasure? ;)

Truly not yours, ganjubas

[Siege]

Guest,
Truly not yours, ganjubas


Ты еще не приехал?

[f ®]

I think attacking particular nation or nationality is quite racist view. there is no such thing as uzbek can do better than russian or korean etc. it is all bound to your ability and willingness to do the job. Presense of russians & russian language gave us a lot of knowledge and greater access to world. so why 'attack' them rather than learning from them where approprite.

look k, who's attacking particular nation over here? is it not Siege, who talks about "uzbeks with slave mentality - harips", or some guys talking about "inferior uzbeks, who have no work ethic" and "skillfull russians, who used to "teach" uzbeks culture"('russian culture' in common perception is how to drink vodka and sleep with your freind's wife) ? why do you react so utterly to every statment on uzbeks being not worse than any other nation? where is your self esteem if you are uzbek or citizen of Uzbekistan? do not be so passionate about heiling other nationalities by diminishing esteem of uzbeks.

p.s. as for characteristic features of nations: there is a notion "comparative advantage of nations", so under this motions uzbeks tend to be really hardworking, but, what I can say from own observation, uzbeks are often too kind and do not fight for their rights, they are satisfied with least :(

[Siege]

f ®,


triggerhappy, again you have comprehension problems, the point here is performance of uzbek workers in UzDaewoo, not about the factory. Remember, what some russians used to say "uzbeks can never work in factories, only what uzbek can do is to work in cotton plantations". And what you see - uzbeks managed to create a new industry, where uzbek workers produce cars with quality, besides UzDaewoo is the Nr.1 in Russia among foreign car exporters. It's ironic, but russians prefer cars like matiz, nexia done by "uzbek, who will never learn how to handle a screw driver".


Sorry, but your stupidity does not know any borders F-r!


Remember, what some russians used to say "uzbeks can never work in factories, only what uzbek can do is to work in cotton plantations".


They never said that but I hear now from Uzbeks is that we are best at taking bribes and selling smth. "Бизада парахорлик конимизда, керак булса одами куттига совунсиз кирибкетамиз" - told me private taxi driver yesteday :D .


And what you see - uzbeks managed to create a new industry, where uzbek workers produce cars with quality


What f-k you talk about?! What f-ing industry are you bsing us about?!
It's 80% imported parts from Korea! We do not craft nothing important in Uzb-n!


besides UzDaewoo is the Nr.1 in Russia among foreign car exporters.


Do you how many cars VAZ makes a year?! About 1,000,000!
Do you how many cars did we import last year?
12,500!
And that's only VAZ!

We shall thank DRACONIAN RUSSIA'S IMPORT TAX, THAT UZDEWOO CARS ARE EXEPT FOR BEING CIS COUNTRY!
IF NOT THAT TAX WE WOULD SELL NO SHIT IN RUSSIA!
AS UZDAEWOO SELLS NO SHIT BESIDES RUSSIA!

P.S. KEEP ON WRITING EXXXTREMLY STUPID THINGS, MAYBE I'LL REPLY, JUST MAYBE, DO NOT FLATTER YOURSELF NOW. :D

[f ®]

f ®,


triggerhappy, again you have comprehension problems, the point here is performance of uzbek workers in UzDaewoo, not about the factory. Remember, what some russians used to say "uzbeks can never work in factories, only what uzbek can do is to work in cotton plantations". And what you see - uzbeks managed to create a new industry, where uzbek workers produce cars with quality, besides UzDaewoo is the Nr.1 in Russia among foreign car exporters. It's ironic, but russians prefer cars like matiz, nexia done by "uzbek, who will never learn how to handle a screw driver".


Sorry, but your stupidity does not know any borders F-r!

well smart Siege - litso tsentralno-aziatskoy natsional'nosti (btw. what do u mean by "central asian look" - there's nothing like that "central asian looking":D), here we go with your reply.




They never said that
Remember, what some russians used to say "uzbeks can never work in factories, only what uzbek can do is to work in cotton plantations".
but I hear now from Uzbeks is that we are best at taking bribes and selling smth. "Бизада парахорлик конимизда, керак булса одами куттига совунсиз кирибкетамиз" - told me private taxi driver yesteday :D .

you wrong, bribary exists among all nations, besides according to the data of transparency international uzbeks (Uzbekistan) is the least corrupt country among former soviet nations azeris(Azerbaijan) being the most corrupt. Note, according to the respected organisation Uzbekistan is less coorupt than Russia ! ;)



And what you see - uzbeks managed to create a new industry, where uzbek workers produce cars with quality


What f-k you talk about?! What f-ing industry are you bsing us about?!
It's 80% imported parts from Korea! We do not craft nothing important in Uzb-n!

read that idiot, I am talking about car manafucturing factory. It does not matter if some parts are imported from other countries, the fact is the car is made in UZ. If you cannot digest this, do and f-k yourself :)



besides UzDaewoo is the Nr.1 in Russia among foreign car exporters.


Do you how many cars VAZ makes a year?! About 1,000,000!

you are mixing up different things Siege, according to russian sorces the most popular imported car in Russia is UzDaewoo. Just check statistics.


We shall thank DRACONIAN RUSSIA'S IMPORT TAX, THAT UZDEWOO CARS ARE EXEPT FOR BEING CIS COUNTRY!
IF NOT THAT TAX WE WOULD SELL NO SHIT IN RUSSIA!
AS UZDAEWOO SELLS NO SHIT BESIDES RUSSIA!

you might be will thank russians & others for that, I woun't. It's a business, russian consumers are interested in nice UzDaewoo cars, they prefer driving comfortavle and price-worthy Nexia or Matit to other car brand, if there is demand there must be supply. Draconian import tax is very unlikely, since russia is going to join WTO and it wount be able to discriminate against uzbek imports, they will be obliged to treat all imported products equally. UzDaewoo was designed to export cars to Russia and former soviet union, I guess there will eb demand for these cars in Afghanistan and China.

However, I do support some critiques about chosing Daewoo as partner for creating a new car industry, Daaewoo turned to be unreliable partner, just hope that GM will take over UzDaewoo in future.

P.S. you were brought up in russian environment and you think like they do, keep on licking smb's ass as it is in your nature :D

[Siege]

f ®, F-r you are your one stupid a-s!
Thaks God you're abroad for good!

[Siege]

Mutafakkir,

First your new nick name sounds like MoFo in german - MutterFacker (Serious)!
I think Muhlis was better! So if you do not change back to Muhlis I promise I'm going to call you Mutafakkir Maimun or Mutafakkir Jumavoy!
It's your choise, now, Muhlis!

Next is end part of horrible material i read today about my brother-Uzbeks in Russia. Read it to the end, it's short!
__________________________________________________ _______________

Последней жертвой стал 22-летний Бекзод Сайфуллаев, скончавшийся от ножевых ран, нанесенных ему группой фашиствующих молодчиков. Его тело было доставлено в Джизак 6 февраля.

Житель Джизака Жамол Ишонкулов, давно занимающийся нелегальной подработкой в России, признает, что его согражданам жить там далеко не безопасно. "Обычно нас всех селят в одно общежитие. То и дело сообщают, что кого-то по соседству избили или убили. Скинхеды врываются в комнаты по ночам и избивают людей", - рассказывает Ишонкулов.

При этом он считает, что лучше рискнуть, чем прозябать в нищете на родине. "Даже когда гибнет друг, домой возвращаться не хочется, - говорит он. – В Узбекистане нам ничего не светит, а там, в России, – хоть денег заработаем".

according to the data of transparency international uzbeks (Uzbekistan) is the least corrupt country among former soviet nations azeris(Azerbaijan) being the most corrupt. Note, according to the respected organisation Uzbekistan is less coorupt than Russia ! ;)

You are kidding, right? I don't care who says it, but it's funny to hear the words "Uzbekistan" and "least corrupt" in the same sentense. You must think we are all a bunch of idiots and will eat this, right?
Hold on, I gotta go puke. :puke:

[MUHLIS]

Sieg Heil, janob Mudakfakkir!
I have recently noted the way you ware your tie. Tell me, do you want to throttle yourself? Yout should better learn how to make a good knot on your tie before placing your picture here. Or hang the badge “Uzbekistan uber alles!!!” instead.
Thank you for your attention to my ties :D
Well, may be you do not like it....but you know what, I REALLY DO NOT CARE!!!, if you like or do not like it ;)
Btw, your english is too complicated for me, please, next time ( if you choose to do so) write with more simple English. Thank you.

[MUHLIS]

Free Radical thank you for your nice postings....I like them.

[mujreem]

Ассаламу алайкум
Мухлим, гапни очиги мен уз фикримни сизнинг ёзган маколангизга билдириб утиришни лузумсиз деб билдим. Сиз хаккингизда менда маълум бир фикр аллакачон пайдо булиб булган. Сизга факат битта саволим бор, шуни сурамокчиман холос.
Сиз умидчисиз, ва хозир охирги курсдасиз, яъни ёзда Узбекистонга кайтиб келишингиз керак тугрими?
мужрим,
вассалам.

P.S. Агар саволимга жавоб берсангиз кейинги сафар сиз хаккингиздаги уз фикримни туликрок билдирган булардим.

[MUHLIS]

Ассаламу алайкум
Мухлим, гапни очиги мен уз фикримни сизнинг ёзган маколангизга билдириб утиришни лузумсиз деб билдим. Сиз хаккингизда менда маълум бир фикр аллакачон пайдо булиб булган. Сизга факат битта саволим бор, шуни сурамокчиман холос.
Сиз умидчисиз, ва хозир охирги курсдасиз, яъни ёзда Узбекистонга кайтиб келишингиз керак тугрими?
мужрим,
вассалам.

P.S. Агар саволимга жавоб берсангиз кейинги сафар сиз хаккингиздаги уз фикримни туликрок билдирган булардим.
Muhreem, menda ham o'z navbatida siz va sizning dunyokarashingiz hususiba'zi bir fikrlar allaqachonlar xosil bo'lgan.
Maqolamga fikr bildirasizmi bildirmaysizmi bu sizning hohishingz...
Men Umidchi emasman, meni yaqiniga ham yo'latishmagan u konkursni..... Lekin siz behijolat o'z fikringizda qolishingiz mumkin.
Vaqt oliy xakam.

[MUHLIS]

Mutafakkir,


Последней жертвой стал 22-летний Бекзод Сайфуллаев, скончавшийся от ножевых ран, нанесенных ему группой фашиствующих молодчиков. Его тело было доставлено в Джизак 6 февраля.

Житель Джизака Жамол Ишонкулов, давно занимающийся нелегальной подработкой в России, признает, что его согражданам жить там далеко не безопасно. "Обычно нас всех селят в одно общежитие. То и дело сообщают, что кого-то по соседству избили или убили. Скинхеды врываются в комнаты по ночам и избивают людей", - рассказывает Ишонкулов.

При этом он считает, что лучше рискнуть, чем прозябать в нищете на родине. "Даже когда гибнет друг, домой возвращаться не хочется, - говорит он. – В Узбекистане нам ничего не светит, а там, в России, – хоть денег заработаем".
no comments

[Prianik]

Mutafakkir, manimcha siz chet elda bir yildan kamrok muddatdasiz shundaymi? bunaka anomaliyala kupchilikda buladi, yani yurtdan uzokda soginch alamida vatanga bulgan soginchni shunaka yul bilan kursatish. I bet everyone is stupid for you apart from uzbeks. Everyone brits, americans, russians. My advise would be get along with local people and integrate into their world just to see the insights. I;m not saying become one of them, but learn something from them (and THERE ARE SOMETHINGS to learn). You'll only benefit.

[MUHLIS]

Mutafakkir, manimcha siz chet elda bir yildan kamrok muddatdasiz shundaymi? bunaka anomaliyala kupchilikda buladi, yani yurtdan uzokda soginch alamida vatanga bulgan soginchni shunaka yul bilan kursatish. I bet everyone is stupid for you apart from uzbeks. Everyone brits, americans, russians. My advise would be get along with local people and integrate into their world just to see the insights. I;m not saying become one of them, but learn something from them (and THERE ARE SOMETHINGS to learn). You'll only benefit.
Very ridiculious generalization. Btw, your "flag" is even more ridiculous....

[prchay]

wow..
Bu topik bizni ikki lagerga ajratib yuboripti.
Avval forsiyparrastlar hujumida qolib ketgan edik.
endi rusiy zabonlar hujumga otishibti.
To Siege and Mujreem:
Bilasizlarmi sizdaka ruslashgan ozbeklarni men kop korganman.ozinglar ozbek bolsanglar ham dilinglar rus.Sizlar ozbeklar oldin "madaniyatsiz" edi ruslar kelgan "madadaniyatlashdi" degan kitoplarni juda kop oqib qoygansizlar.Endi bu togrisida kop bahslar qilish mumkin.ozbeklar(albatta turkiylar. "ozbek" deganda yana ozbek 15 asr paydo boldi dep oylasangizlar kerak,shundaymi?darvoqe ruslar bizga sohta noomlarda ajratib qoyib vaqrtida hop tarihlarni oqitishdide..u vaqtlani endi qoyvurila.)Maslan sizlar yana ozbek bolib turib rus tilida oylaysizlar,shundaymi?juda kulgili qanday qilib yana ozbekman dep yuribsizlar.din,islom deganda faqat Karl Markslarni talqinlari orqali qaraysizlar.kalla ishlatmaysizlar.Hozirgi ozbekiston ahvoliga ham musilmonchilik,ozbek madaniyati aybdor dep oylaysizlar.Bu hammasi ruslarning bizning halqni uzoq davrda "brainwashed" qilganini sababi.HUlar shunday tarih bizga yozib berishti uni oqigan odam boshin kotarolmay qoldi.Oshnaqa kitplani kop oqib qoygansilar.hozir esa rossia mafkurasiga siginib yuribsiz.olloh ozi insofilani bersin
p.s:Vaqt juda oz bolgani uchun tez yozishga togri keldi.Hatolaga etibor bermayla.

[guest from NY]

I think Mutafakkir is wrong.....

B.O.Y, u r bulshitting. The guys r just open minded, 'coz they got more intercultural experience.
I don't like nationalists wherever they be, germany, france, India or China, etc. I myself was kind of pro-uzbek nationalist when I got here, to Western Europe, then I have realized that that was stuipid. Of course, a man must be a patriot to make good deeds for his country, but he shall not be nationalisticlly oriented - it will hurt the country in the long run. Remember, respect others and u'll be respected.

Peace,

[MUHLIS]

B.O.Y, u r bulshitting. The guys r just open minded, 'coz they got more intercultural experience.
I don't like nationalists wherever they be, germany, france, India or China, etc. I myself was kind of pro-uzbek nationalist when I got here, to Western Europe, then I have realized that that was stuipid. Of course, a man must be a patriot to make good deeds for his country, but he shall not be nationalisticlly oriented - it will hurt the country in the long run. Remember, respect others and u'll be respected.

Peace,
Hey "open minded or empty minded", caring about Nations future and wel being is very different than nationalizm!!!!!!!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

Hey "open minded or empty minded", caring about Nations future and wel being is very different than nationalizm!!!!!!!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:[/quote]


A s durakami ya voobshe ne razgovarivayu :biggrin:

[MUHLIS]

Hey "open minded or empty minded", caring about Nations future and wel being is very different than nationalizm!!!!!!!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:


A s durakami ya voobshe ne razgovarivayu :biggrin:[/QUOTE]
In addition I hate using russian when other language options are available!

[trigger-happy]

caring about Nations future and wel being is very different than nationalizm!!!!!!!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
Thanks for opening our eyes. :D
To be honest, MUHLIS, you do seem to go beyond simply caring and often seem nationalistic to me. The way you put down other nationalities, especially Russians, is nationalism. It doesn't matter who started the cycle of mutual disrespect first, if you really care about Uzbekistan, you have to rise above it. Yeah, Russians may be "drunken pigs" as you so un-nationalistically put it, but I'm sure even they must have some redeeming qualities. You know what I mean, or am I just wasting my time?
Take it easy. :D

[MUHLIS]

caring about Nations future and wel being is very different than nationalizm!!!!!!!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
Thanks for opening our eyes. :D
To be honest, MUHLIS, you do seem to go beyond simply caring and often seem nationalistic to me. The way you put down other nationalities, especially Russians, is nationalism. It doesn't matter who started the cycle of mutual disrespect first, if you really care about Uzbekistan, you have to rise above it. Yeah, Russians may be "drunken pigs" as you so un-nationalistically put it, but I'm sure even they must have some redeeming qualities. You know what I mean, or am I just wasting my time?
Take it easy. :D
Keep your nose safer!

[trigger-happy]

Keep your nose safer!
Funny you should mention my nose. I am coming down with cold, so it's pretty sore and red. :(

[MUHLIS]

Keep your nose safer!
Funny you should mention my nose. I am coming down with cold, so it's pretty sore and red. :(
I wonder if it only because of cold

[trigger-happy]

why else :?:

[MUHLIS]

why else :?:
try to guess ;)

[trigger-happy]

Your suggestion is so ludicrous, I won't even dignify it with a real response.
And I thought you were a cultured boy. :(

[MUHLIS]

Your suggestion is so ludicrous, I won't even dignify it with a real response.
And I thought you were a cultured boy. :(
Culture is very abctract term.....its definition chages from person to person...from nation to nation from time to time....you know what i mean? ;)

[trigger-happy]

Your suggestion is so ludicrous, I won't even dignify it with a real response.
And I thought you were a cultured boy. :(
Culture is very abctract term.....its definition chages from person to person...from nation to nation from time to time....you know what i mean? ;)
Yep, I know exactly what you mean. In some families, they will consider it uncultured, if their child doesn't know how to use a knife and a fork. In others, as long as he doesn't belch, it's cultured enough. Yet in others, even farting at the table won't get you banned. I think it's obvious what kind of culture I was talking about. ;)

[MUHLIS]

Your suggestion is so ludicrous, I won't even dignify it with a real response.
And I thought you were a cultured boy. :(
Culture is very abctract term.....its definition chages from person to person...from nation to nation from time to time....you know what i mean? ;)
Yep, I know exactly what you mean. In some families, they will consider it uncultured, if their child doesn't know how to use a knife and a fork. In others, as long as he doesn't belch, it's cultured enough. Yet in others, even farting at the table won't get you banned. I think it's obvious what kind of culture I was talking about. ;)
In addition what you have said, I can say that some people think drinking and smoking for women and even sometimes children is culture. Wearing very open clothes is a culture....While for others....it is the sign of
barbarianism.......This kind of differences can be applied for whole societies too... ;)

[trigger-happy]

In addition what you have said, I can say that some people think drinking and smoking for women and even sometimes children is culture. Wearing very open clothes is a culture....While for others....it is the sign of
barbarianism.......This kind of differences can be applied for whole societies too... ;)
agree 100%.
But I still didn't guess what you meant by other reasons. Please explain.

[MUHLIS]

In addition what you have said, I can say that some people think drinking and smoking for women and even sometimes children is culture. Wearing very open clothes is a culture....While for others....it is the sign of
barbarianism.......This kind of differences can be applied for whole societies too... ;)
agree 100%.
But I still didn't guess what you meant by other reasons. Please explain.
The other reasons can be for instance...exessive eagerness about others business.....you know what i mean? ;)

[trigger-happy]

I must not be sophisticated enough to get your joke. You have to tell me in plain words, like to a child, ok? Without seeing your facial expressions and gestures, such jokes can be hard to understand. ;) My first guess was alcoholism again, but you don't know me, so have no basis for such an assumption. So it must be something else. but what :?:

[MUHLIS]

I must not be sophisticated enough to get your joke. You have to tell me in plain words, like to a child, ok? Without seeing your facial expressions and gestures, such jokes can be hard to understand. ;) My first guess was alcoholism again, but you don't know me, so have no basis for such an assumption. So it must be something else. but what :?:
ok forget it

[prchay]

B.O.Y, u r bulshitting. The guys r just open minded, 'coz they got more intercultural experience.
I don't like nationalists wherever they be, germany, france, India or China, etc. I myself was kind of pro-uzbek nationalist when I got here, to Western Europe, then I have realized that that was stuipid. Of course, a man must be a patriot to make good deeds for his country, but he shall not be nationalisticlly oriented - it will hurt the country in the long run. Remember, respect others and u'll be respected.

Peace,meni tshunmabsiz hurmatli guest. yana bir bor postimni oqib chiqing.

Birinchidan men sizga ohshab hech qachon "pro-uzbek nationalist" bolmaganman.Bizning halqning milliy harakterlarinig salbiy tomonlarini juda ham yahshi bilaman.Boshqa halqlardan organishimiz kerak bolgan narslar juda ham kop. men hechqaysi millatni kamsitmayabganim yoki ularga qarshi "hujumga" otmayabman.Men hamisha salbiy tomonlarimizni tanqid qilib kelganman.Ha men barcha hudo yaratib qoygan halqni hurmat qiliaman.Ammo bazibir galimislarning bizni halqga qarshi qilayotgan isyon,fitnalariga qarshi chiqishdan boshqa ilojim qolmayapti.Ular hudi "kritika" qilayotgandek,bolmagur narsalarni ham kop gapirvoradilar.Masalan sovetlarning bizga yozib bergan tarihi bunga misool bola oladi.Har bir odam boshqa millat vakillarini hurmat qilish kerak lekin odam ozligini ham ununtmaslik kerak .Qloversa sizni kamsitishganda ogzizni ochib turishiz bu manqurtlikdir(yoki lapashanglik).70 yil shunday bolib keldi.Bizni halqning dostona va yuvoshligidan foydalanib ho[ ustimizdan kulishdi.Hozir paytda ham shu harakterimiz hukumatimizni halqni ustidan hohlagn narsasini qilishga yol qoyib beryapti.
Siegga kelsak u ozbekmi yoki yoqmi buni bilmaymanku lekin u rossa pro-komunistik va pro-russian mafkura bilan yahshigina "barainwashed" bolgan odamligi shuindoqqina kozga tashlanib turibti.Bunday odamlar haqqoniy tanqid qila olmaydilar.Doyim milliy guruingiz hisoblangan simvollar ideallar..v.ahakozo larga yopiship bizni kamsitadilar.Sghunday paytlarda men himoyaga otishni boshlayman.va siz bu himoyana boshqa millatlarga qarshi qilingan hujum dep aytmoqchi bolsangiz bu sizni ishingiz.Agar oziz ozizni himiya qilmasangiz boshqa hechkim sizni himoya qilmaydi.
P.S:Ozila bilasla vaqtim kam.juda Tez yozishim kerak.Hatolarim uchun uzr sorayman.

[MUHLIS]

B.O.Y, u r bulshitting. The guys r just open minded, 'coz they got more intercultural experience.
I don't like nationalists wherever they be, germany, france, India or China, etc. I myself was kind of pro-uzbek nationalist when I got here, to Western Europe, then I have realized that that was stuipid. Of course, a man must be a patriot to make good deeds for his country, but he shall not be nationalisticlly oriented - it will hurt the country in the long run. Remember, respect others and u'll be respected.

Peace,meni tshunmabsiz hurmatli guest. yana bir bor postimni oqib chiqing.

Birinchidan men sizga ohshab hech qachon "pro-uzbek nationalist" bolmaganman.Bizning halqning milliy harakterlarinig salbiy tomonlarini juda ham yahshi bilaman.Boshqa halqlardan organishimiz kerak bolgan narslar juda ham kop. men hechqaysi millatni kamsitmayabganim yoki ularga qarshi "hujumga" otmayabman.Men hamisha salbiy tomonlarimizni tanqid qilib kelganman.Ha men barcha hudo yaratib qoygan halqni hurmat qiliaman.Ammo bazibir galimislarning bizni halqga qarshi qilayotgan isyon,fitnalariga qarshi chiqishdan boshqa ilojim qolmayapti.Ular hudi "kritika" qilayotgandek,bolmagur narsalarni ham kop gapirvoradilar.Masalan sovetlarning bizga yozib bergan tarihi bunga misool bola oladi.Har bir odam boshqa millat vakillarini hurmat qilish kerak lekin odam ozligini ham ununtmaslik kerak .Qloversa sizni kamsitishganda ogzizni ochib turishiz bu manqurtlikdir(yoki lapashanglik).70 yil shunday bolib keldi.Bizni halqning dostona va yuvoshligidan foydalanib ho[ ustimizdan kulishdi.Hozir paytda ham shu harakterimiz hukumatimizni halqni ustidan hohlagn narsasini qilishga yol qoyib beryapti.
Siegga kelsak u ozbekmi yoki yoqmi buni bilmaymanku lekin u rossa pro-komunistik va pro-russian mafkura bilan yahshigina "barainwashed" bolgan odamligi shuindoqqina kozga tashlanib turibti.Bunday odamlar haqqoniy tanqid qila olmaydilar.Doyim milliy guruingiz hisoblangan simvollar ideallar..v.ahakozo larga yopiship bizni kamsitadilar.Sghunday paytlarda men himoyaga otishni boshlayman.va siz bu himoyana boshqa millatlarga qarshi qilingan hujum dep aytmoqchi bolsangiz bu sizni ishingiz.Agar oziz ozizni himiya qilmasangiz boshqa hechkim sizni himoya qilmaydi.
P.S:Ozila bilasla vaqtim kam.juda Tez yozishim kerak.Hatolarim uchun uzr sorayman.
Shu yahshiyam siz keldiz.....bitta ozim juda yolgizlanib kolgan edim... itdek talashdi bir hil vahti..... :( ...Mayli bizi mahallada ham bayram bolar a?... ;)

[prchay]

ozim qozogiston tarflarga bir safar qilib keldim u yerlarda havol yana ham nochor
silani korip yana hursand bolib kettim