Neye/Nasil Soylersiniz? / How do you say ?

[nomad]

Can you tell us how Uzbeks, Turkmens, Uygurs, Azeris, Kazhaks, Yakuts, Kirghizs, and all others including Magyars, Finns, etc say these basic words (for me) ? (I am writing them in Turkish as a Oguz/Selcuk Turk living in Turkey - Add yours) - Dillerinizde, bunlari nasil soylersiniz? (ben Oguz/Selcuk Turkcesinde nasil soylendigini yaziyorum. Siz kendinizinkini ekleyin) -

- Water / Su

- Air / Hava

- Mother / Ana

- I / Ben

- You / Sen

- He,She,It / O

and numbers ?

- One / Bir ,

- Two / Iki ,

- Three / Uc ,

- Four / Dort

- Five = Bes

- Six / Alti

- Seven / Yedi

- Eight / Sekiz

- Nine / Dokuz

- Ten / On

[SmIlIk]

Water/su(turkish)/l'eau(french)/water(dutch)/wasser(german)/acqua(italian)/agua(spanish)


- Air / lucht(dutch)/Air(french)/luft(german)/Aria(italian)/Aire(spanish)

- Mother /Ana(Turkish)/ Moeder(Dutch)/Mère(french)/Mutter(german)/Madre(Italaian)/Madre(spanish)

To'risini etaman...charchadim uzhe :))

[magyaRulez]

Water = Viz

Air = Levego

Mother = Anya

I = En

You = Te

He,She,It = O

One = Egy

Two = Ketto

Three = Harom

Four = Negy

Five = Ot

Six = Hat

Seven = Het

Eight = Nyolc

Nine = Kilenc

Ten = Tiz

Water/su(turkish)/l'eau(french)/water(dutch)/wasser(german)/acqua(italian)/agua(spanish)


- Air / lucht(dutch)/Air(french)/luft(german)/Aria(italian)/Aire(spanish)

- Mother /Ana(Turkish)/ Moeder(Dutch)/Mère(french)/Mutter(german)/Madre(Italaian)/Madre(spanish)

To'risini etaman...charchadim uzhe :))

Bu Altavista Translator.

Uzbek-Vista translator ne diyor? ;)

[SmIlIk]

Afsuski bu Altavista translator Degil...Uzbek-Vista translator hali yaratomadim :)

[nomad]

Water = Viz

Air = Levego

Mother = Anya

I = En

You = Te

He,She,It = O

One = Egy

Two = Ketto

Three = Harom

Four = Negy

Five = Ot

Six = Hat

Seven = Het

Eight = Nyolc

Nine = Kilenc

Ten = Tiz

Thank you, MagyaRules. It seems that only "Anya, En, Te, O" are similar to our language in which we say "Ana, Ben/Men, Sen/Ten, and O".
But the numbers are completely different. For example, you say Tiz for Ten - I found this surprize because Hungary comes from "On-Ogur" word which is an Ural-Altaic-Turkic word and here "ON" means "TEN". But you say "TIZ" instead of "ON" or "HUN" which means "TIZ" in your language, or "TEN" in English. Maybe, you Magyars, you got the name of the numbers from "Indo-Euro" languages.

Ps: "Guest" above who said "Uzbek-Vista" was me. I posted without login

[SmIlIk]

Mayli, Mayli...nomad agar o'sha yoqqayam ikkita o'zbekni oborib qo'yseyiz ula ham o'zbekcha gapirishini boshlidi...yoki mani MISSIONER qilib jo'natib yuboring..Uzbek-Vistani yozaman Guest bilan ;)

[nomad]

Mayli, Mayli...nomad agar o'sha yoqqayam ikkita o'zbekni oborib qo'yseyiz ula ham o'zbekcha gapirishini boshlidi...yoki mani MISSIONER qilib jo'natib yuboring..Uzbek-Vistani yozaman Guest bilan ;)

SmIlIk, (adin, "smile"liktan geli? ;-) )

Ozbek-Vistan yaratmak gerek aslinda. Adini, Ozbek-Fistani koyariz.

Ps: Fistan, bir giysi/urba (kiz giyecegi) - bilirsin?

[SmIlIk]

hahahahahah.....uyat, uyat:) shunaqa pokiza niyatlarimni pars givoribsiz:)
hozircha no comments, looool

Ozbek-Fistani hahahah

[nomad]

shunaqa pokiza niyatlarimni pars givoribsiz:)


Burayi tam anladim diyemem (can't say I understood here)

Shunaqa = $una = this?
pokiza = ?
niyatlarimni = niyetlerimi = my intention ?
pars = fars ?
givoribsiz = ?

I am a new at this Ozbek site, you know.

Though I am not naturally honest Nomad, I am so sometimes by chance;)

Seriously, do you really know "fistan" ? This is a kind of cloth girls wear in our village (central anatolia) where I was born. Ok. Enough about this English. Explain in Uzbek language. I have to understand to be able to read this site.

[DenRose]

To Nomad :

Water - suv (uzbek), suu (kyrgyz)-the accent on the last "u"
Air - havo (uzbek), aba (kyrgyz) - the accent on the last "a"
Mother - ona (uzbek)
I - men (uzbek)
You - sen (uzbek)
He/she/it - u (uzbek)
One - bir (uzbek and kyrgyz), byr (kazakh)
Two - eki (kazakh), ikki (uzbek)
Three - uch (uzbek, kazakh)
Four - to'rt (uzbek)
Five - besh (uzbek, kyrgyz), bes (kazakh)
Six - olti (uzbek) , alti (kazakh, kyrgyz)
Seven - yetti (uzbek), jeti (kazakh)
Eight - sakkiz (uzbek), segiz (kazakh, kyrgyz)
Nine - to'qqiz (uzbek), toguz (kyrgyz)
Ten - un (uzbek), on (kazakh, kyrgyz)

[nomad]

Sagol DenRose,

Ozetleyelim;

Water - suv (uzbek), suu (kyrgyz)-su (turkiye)
Air - havo (uzbek), aba (kyrgyz) - hava (turkiye)
Mother - ona (uzbek) - ana (turkche) - anya (Magyar/Hungarian)
I - men (uzbek) - ben (turkche) - en (magyar)
You - sen (uzbek) - sen (turkche) - te (magyar)
He/she/it - u (uzbek) - o (turkce) - o (mahyar)
One - bir (uzbek and kyrgyz), byr (kazakh) - bir (turkiye=tr)
Two - eki (kazakh), ikki (uzbek) - iki (tr)
Three - uch (uzbek, kazakh) - uch (tr)
Four - to'rt (uzbek) - dort (tr)
Five - besh (uzbek, kyrgyz), bes (kazakh)- be$ (tr)
Six - olti (uzbek) , alti (kazakh, kyrgyz) - alti (tr)
Seven - yetti (uzbek), jeti (kazakh) - yedi (tr)
Eight - sakkiz (uzbek), segiz (kazakh, kyrgyz) - sekiz (tr)
Nine - to'qqiz (uzbek), toguz (kyrgyz) - dokuz (tr)
Ten - un (uzbek), on (kazakh, kyrgyz) - on (tr)

---------------------------------

Kesin ki, Azerbaycanda da ayni sozlerdir.

Goruldugu gibi, bir akrabalik var. Hatta, Magyarlarla (people of Hungary) bile akrabalik var. Amma bu kimin umurunda. Ozbek veya Turk olmasi onemli degil. Onemli olan, "ciddi bir dil egitimi almaksizin, baskalarini anlayabilmektir." ;-) Ayrica, herkes bilir, bu dilleri konusanlarin akraba oldugunu - amma kime faydasi var akraba olmanin? Ortak bir dil bilirim, onu konusalim? "pul" ;)

[etchgow]

nomad, Ozbekcha qapirishlamak icin q'op yahsi bir sahifa

http://www.notam02.no/~hcholm/altlang/ht/Uzbek.html

gulmekten yerlere yigilabilirsin

[etchgow]

Sumerce'de yag icin "ia" deniyormus. Ayrica uc (3) icin "us", on (10) icin "u" denirken otuz (30) icin "us u" (yani uc on = 3 x 10) diyorlarmis. Ancak bu sayi sistemi bizde de halen var: Seksen = Sekiz on (8 x 10), Doksan = Dokuz on (9 x 10) ancak digerleri zaman icinde degismis

Ayrica ilk okunan Sumerce cumle de : "Sumer ne me" yani "Sumer ne bu" seklinde (ya da Ozbekcha qaprishlarsaq "Sumer nime?" denebilir)

Kaynak: Olcas Suleyman'in "Yazinin Dili" kitabi

[nomad]

etchgow, aradim ve daha cok bilgi buldum.

Karshilashtirmali "eski" (ancient) turkce - english - sumerice

http://www.compmore.net/~tntr/sumerturka.html

[to etchgow]

etchgow
gel sana bir az ozbekche ogreteyim.
ilk once

oz. "ozbekcha gapirmoq uchun" olur

sonra tr."chok" oz. "kop" olur
ve sadece chogunlukni soylemek ichin kullanilir.
meselen ozbekchede "kop ogir(agir)" olmaz.
ama "juda ogir" olur. yani "juda" inglizchede "very" anlamindadir.
ve bizdeki "yahshi" sozu sizdeki gibi kuillanilmaz.
maselen "yahshi odam" diyebilirsiniz. ama "bu adam kop yahshi" olmaz.
yani ozbekchede "bu odam juda zor" olur.
ozbekche "zor" sozu inglizchede "excellent" anlamindadir.onun ichin
"bu juda zor sayt" dep soylesen dogru olur.
ama turkche "zor" ozbekchede "qiyin" olur.
ozbekche dil ogreten turkche siteler de chok ciddiy hatalari buluyorum.

etchgow sen aptalmisin bolye siteleri post yaptigin ichin seni burdan ban yapmalari gerek

[etchgow]

etchgow
gel sana bir az ozbekche ogreteyim.
ilk once

oz. "ozbekcha gapirmoq uchun" olur

sonra tr."chok" oz. "kop" olur
ve sadece chogunlukni soylemek ichin kullanilir.
meselen ozbekchede "kop ogir(agir)" olmaz.
ama "juda ogir" olur. yani "juda" inglizchede "very" anlamindadir.
ve bizdeki "yahshi" sozu sizdeki gibi kuillanilmaz.
maselen "yahshi odam" diyebilirsiniz. ama "bu adam kop yahshi" olmaz.
yani ozbekchede "bu odam juda zor" olur.
ozbekche "zor" sozu inglizchede "excellent" anlamindadir.onun ichin
"bu juda zor sayt" dep soylesen dogru olur.
ama turkche "zor" ozbekchede "qiyin" olur.
ozbekche dil ogreten turkche siteler de chok ciddiy hatalari buluyorum.


Nasraddin Hoca (Molla ya da Afandi) bir gun cani elma cekince bir bahceya dalmis bir agaca cikmis elma yemeye baslamis. O sirada bahcenin sahibisi gelmis "sen kimsin ne yapiyorsun burada?" demis, hoca da "ben bulbulum dala kondum" demis adam da "bulbulsen ot bakalim" demis, hoca da "gaak gaak" demis, adam "bu ne bicim bulbul otmesi" demis hoca da "acemi bulbul ancak bu kadar oter" demis..

Ozellikle Ozbekcha konusmaya zaten calismiyorum, ortalama bir Orta Asya Turkcesi konustum. Sen benim "q'op" dimemdan "juda"yi anlayabiliyorsan o zaman ha "Q'op" ha "juda" demisim ne farkeder? Turkce'de "juda" = "cok" ve "q'op"="pek" diye gecmistir ama gordugun uzere ikisi de hemen hemen ayni anlamda kullanilir. Yoksa sen eli sopali bir Ozbekcha okutcusumisan? "Yok oyle denmez boyle denir" DONK! Gerek yok bence insan nasil soyledigi degil anlasilmasi onemli.



etchgow sen aptalmisin bolye siteleri post yaptigin ichin seni burdan ban yapmalari gerek


yaa peki sen misan http://www.forum.uz/viewtopic.php?t=11050&start=390 sayfasinda o agzindan bal akarak (!)


yapmis yani siz gotunu yalayan nazileri gotunu kesmis


yoksa gotunu kisiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiip yur
turkler arasinda bu kadar dalbayoplar var oldugunu bile bilmiyordun


kmlst pici


laflarini yazan? Haa demek ki once hic takma ad falan almadan girip saga sola sovenlere bir engel olunmasi gerekiyormus. Ben sadece buraya insanlar gulsun diye bir baglanti yazdim (post etmek degil post ayilarin derisine denir, ban yapmak diye de Turkce'de Ozbekcha'da laf yoktir banmak vardir o da suya batirmaya derler ben sana once biraz Ozbekcha ya da Turkce ogretiim ne dersin?

[Pax]

Can you tell us how Uzbeks, Turkmens, Uygurs, Azeris, Kazhaks, Yakuts, Kirghizs, and all others including Magyars, Finns, etc say these basic words (for me) ? (I am writing them in Turkish as a Oguz/Selcuk Turk living in Turkey - Add yours) - Dillerinizde, bunlari nasil soylersiniz? (ben Oguz/Selcuk Turkcesinde nasil soylendigini yaziyorum. Siz kendinizinkini ekleyin) -

- Water / Su
Uz: Suv (pronounced su/suu) kg: suu

- Air / Hava
uz: havo (in lingustical terms "o" in uz is a back "a" while "a" is fronted)
kg: aba
- Mother / Ana
Ona - ene

- I / Ben
uz - kg- (kz)
men (often pronounced as "man") - men

- You / Sen
sen (often pronounced as "san") - sen

- He,She,It / O

u - al

and numbers ?

- One / Bir ,
bir (but you may hear it as "bır") - bir
- Two / Iki , [quote]

ikki - eki
[quote]- Three / Uc ,
uch - uch (the frontedness of the "u" is present is Kg but barely distinct in uz)- kaz: ush

- Four / Dort
to'r(t) - tort
again in uz "o" is not that rounden as in kg. and may sound as plain "o". often the last "t" is silent in uz.
- Five = Bes
besh - besh- kaz: bes

- Six / Alti
olti - altı
in uz there's no letter to represent the "ı" sound. but it exists in the speech, though not in the written text.

- Seven / Yedi
yetti :) - jeti/ceti - zheti/jeti

- Eight / Sekiz
sakkiz - segiz

- Nine / Dokuz
to'qqiz - toghuz

- Ten / On
o'n - on -on

[nomad]

Sagol, Pax.

Actually, those words in Turkish I typed above are not exatly same. But my keybord is English and can't type them. For example, 6 is not written as "alti", but like "altI", with small "I" which doesn't exist in English. As you are in Istanbul, you probably know these..

By the way, I found a good web site with many Altaic dictionaries:

http://www.yourdictionary.com/languages/altaic.html

[nomad]

I saw an interesting page about pronounciations of Ozbek lang. They are Bahar/Yaz/Ki$ as we say.
It seems that seasons are pronounced same as Turkish - but month names in Ozbek as well as Azerb. are almost same of indo-europe names.

But most interesting is in the name of days; Some days are most important in Ozbek while some others are most important in Ozbek lang. Does this have any meaning in cultural comparisons?

Here are day names in Turkish and in Ozbek languages;


(I am writing Uzbek day names with Turkish character as I hear here

http://cassandra.sprex.com/teachionary/applets/Uzbek_time_days.html

Turkish ------ Uzbek

Pazartesi (veya Pazar Ertesi) ----- Du$amba
Sali ------ Ti$amba
Car$amba ----- Cor$ahma
Per$embe ----- Per$amba
Cuma ----- Cuma
Cumartesi (veya Cuma Ertesi) ----- $amba
Pazar ------- Yah$amba

---------------------------

So, I understand, except "Cuma", all day names in Uzbek take "$amba" as a reference. So, we can say there are 2 main day in Uzbek: "cuma" and "$amba"
All other 5 days are derivatives of "$amba."

On the other hand, in Turkey, there are 4 main days: "cuma", "$amba", "sali" and "pazar/bazar." The other 3 days are derivated from "cuma", "$amba" and "bazar".

We can understand other day names; but most common name is "$amba".
Where does this word come from? An old turkic word (i.e., shamanistic?) or a persian word?

Ps: by the way, we a Selcuk boy in our village in central anatolia still use these names for days "bazar, bazar ertesi, aralik, dernek, carsamba, persembe, cuma and cuma ertesi" - Yes, "aralik" for "sali" and "dernek" for "carsamba"... in old days, "carsamba" for us was probably gathering/toplanma day for our community. So, we can say we were "communists" in old days ;-)

[Oljas]

shamba is a Persian word, not Turkic and it means day

For Sunday, it is yah (one) - shamba (day) = first day
for monday it is du (two) - shamba (day) = second day
for tuesday it is ti (three) - shamba (day) = third day
for wednesday it is cor (four) - shamba (day) = fourth day
for thursday it is per (five) - shamba = fifth day

so the days in Uzbek are actually derived from their Persian names (whereas only Carsamba and Persembe are used the same way in Turkish)

As Persians have converted to Islam, the sixth day (which should have been called actually as shesh- shamba) became Cuma - which means the gathering day in Arabic, as males would gather for the prayer.

Btw if Wednesday was your gathering day it has nothing to do with Turkic identity, and if you were communists, then where is your politburo, where is your Komitat Goudasvennoy Bezopasbosti? Did you also kill whoever did oppose your policies?

Pre-islamic Turks did use a numerical calendar (days and months given numbers not names) with 12 animals for 12 years' periods. This is an about 4600 year-old calendar and later was adopted by the Chinese, yet with different animal names (including dragon). You can learn about it from http://www.tonyukuk.net

[nomad]

"....if Wednesday was your gathering day it has nothing to do with Turkic identity..." [said by Oljas]

Well, our community lives in a small town called Durgut in central anatolia of Turkey. Our community is a small one descendent from Kinik sons of Oguz (Kinik = a Oguz Selcuk boy.) We have never called ourselves Osmanli Turks and we still do not call ourselves so. You remember Celebi Isyans? which were "dirlik/duzenlik isyans" of some Selcuk men who were against Osmanli's lale devri-like rules. Osmanli erleri had killed tousands of these Selcuk men. We are from this boys. We are not a degenerated/mixed community because no people has left this town (2000 populatione) and no other people have lived in our small town. We still practice our very old traditions. So, we have preserved our old traditions and day names much better than many Turk boys in Turkey. So, we still use "Dernek" name for the day of Carsamba. We have been using this name for centuries. So, this "dernek" (meaning gathering of community) has nothing to do with Turkic culture? For you, it can be so. For me, Carsamba is DERNEK / Toplanma day for our community.. and I am NATURAL one.. and like to join this COMMUNITY - so, I am NATURAL COMMUNIST...

Ps: Well, shall we call my new economic system NATURAL DERNEK? lol - ok for me.

Back to topic.

Thanks for meaning of the word "$amba".

As for about the books about Turkic history & languages; Almost all of them have been written by westerners, russians, and chinese. So, I don't belive most of what these Zens have written and I do not need to learn about myself from them.. There must be a day name "dernek" or its another pronounciation in old turkic history, pre-islamic history.

[Pax]

Sagol, Pax.

Actually, those words in Turkish I typed above are not exatly same. But my keybord is English and can't type them. For example, 6 is not written as "alti", but like "altI", with small "I" which doesn't exist in English. As you are in Istanbul, you probably know these..

Sure it is so. But even if you don't have the Turkish keyboard, still you can add it to your keyboard option which is in the bottom right corner of the screen and type in Turkish. It's enogh if you know the places of the Turkish letters: ş, ç, ü, ğ, ect.

And so you are in the US? Studying there?

[Pax]

Actually you misheard the pronounciation.
Turkish ------ Uzbek

Pazartesi (veya Pazar Ertesi) ----- Du$amba
Sali ------ Ti$amba
Car$amba ----- Cor$ahma
Per$embe ----- Per$amba
Cuma ----- Cuma
Cumartesi (veya Cuma Ertesi) ----- $amba
Pazar ------- Yah$amba

---------------------------

Salı is "seshamba", the "se" before "shamba" is "three", not "ti" as was alleged. But I agree with "shamba".
perşembe -> parşamba. in our dialect we even say "payşamba."
However in Persian, from which the names of the weekdays derived, "per"/ "par" is does not mean five. Five is "panch"/ "pench" - remember Turkish "penche"? That's where it has come. Slowly, "panch" assimilated into the into the phonology of the word and became "par".

pazar -> yaKşamba.
Remeber words like "yeknesak", "yegane", "yekta" etc. These are derivitives of "yek".

On the other hand, in Turkey, there are 4 main days: "cuma", "$amba", "sali" and "pazar/bazar." The other 3 days are derivated from "cuma", "$amba" and "bazar".

In Uzbek one can also say "Bozor kuni" (pazar günü) refering to Sunday, as it is customary that big markets are held at that day.

From a çorumian :) acquintance I heard that they -the elderly in particular- also use the same names as we do, namely: Yekşembe, Düşembe, Çarşamba etc.