United Turkistan

[Aziz]

Assalamu Alaikum brothers
many of Turkistan's children were taken away from it
My grandfather is one of them
I'm now in Saudi Arabia
I feel that I belong to somewhere else
yes it is Turkistan
I dream of United Turkistan
faithfull, powerfull, rich, strong, and well respected country
I believe in it
and you must believe
what can we do to make true?

[MUHLIS]

Qadrli Azizbek,
United Turkistan is cherished dream of millions of people living in Uzbekistan and other parts of Central Asia. So many great people in the past have fought in the name of unity, dignity, and freedom of Turkistan. Hammalaridan Alloh rozi bo'lsin. I have posted several posts telling stories about the true patriots of Turkistan. They are in Uzbek, I am not sure if you can read them or not.
You can read some of my thought about unification issues of turkistan at
http://www.cagateway.org/forum.php?fst=13&lng=1

My user name is taraqqiyot. You may find them quite controversial, but in my opinion that is the reality.

[dervish]

Well dream about it. I am loosing hope I think, about Turkistan.
I am sure I can't see it. Maybe my grand grand children will see it.


Assalamu Alaikum brothers
many of Turkistan's children were taken away from it
My grandfather is one of them
I'm now in Saudi Arabia
I feel that I belong to somewhere else
yes it is Turkistan
I dream of United Turkistan
faithfull, powerfull, rich, strong, and well respected country
I believe in it
and you must believe
what can we do to make true?

[erk]

Well dream about it. I am loosing hope I think, about Turkistan.
I am sure I can't see it. Maybe my grand grand children will see it.

Well Turkistan and Turan are different issues. A strong and united Turkistan will lead to Turan. Uzbekistan, Kazakistan, Kırgızistan and Turkmenistan have no choice but to unite. Look at your neigbours: China, Russia, İran and India in the south. All great powers. You have to unite or you will be under their control once again.

[dervish]

As Turkey is under control of EU and USA...

Well Turkistan and Turan are different issues. A strong and united Turkistan will lead to Turan. Uzbekistan, Kazakistan, Kırgızistan and Turkmenistan have no choice but to unite. Look at your neigbours: China, Russia, İran and India in the south. All great powers. You have to unite or you will be under their control once again.

[erk]

As Turkey is under control of EU and USA...

Yes its the truth. We are under their control. We have to unite to be strong establish Turan and led our way to a totally free country.
I hope Turkey unites with Azerbaijan first in 15 20 years time.

[Sigma]

Turcic nations, as well all the muslim nations HAVE TO SET UP rapid forces like NATO, and after that everybody will find us equal. Until then we are divided and perishable one by one, both culturally and socially. Think about UNITED MUSLIM FORCES/UMF. In the real world power comes first, then everything else. Agree???

[dervish]

Before get united there is two main problems.
1. spiritual (which depends on education level of people)
2. material (which depends on economical level of people)

People are so polarized in Turkey. So when someone will say we need education another one will say we already have it, Ataturk gave us modern education. When someone will try to fix economy another one will say "they are bigots, they live in past, they can't fix economy, we the modern Ataturk children will fix it"

I think polarization is starting in CA Turkic republics. So I am loosing hope.



Yes its the truth. We are under their control. We have to unite to be strong establish Turan and led our way to a totally free country.
I hope Turkey unites with Azerbaijan first in 15 20 years time.

[erk]

Before get united there is two main problems.
1. spiritual (which depends on education level of people)
2. material (which depends on economical level of people)

People are so polarized in Turkey. So when someone will say we need education another one will say we already have it, Ataturk gave us modern education. When someone will try to fix economy another one will say "they are bigots, they live in past, they can't fix economy, we the modern Ataturk children will fix it"

I think polarization is starting in CA Turkic republics. So I am loosing hope.

We have to ask the question: A secular Turan or not. I think that Arabs are the dominant power in the Islam world. So an Islamic unification will mean Arab uniication. Not because Quran is Arabic but also Arabs are about 400-500 million now. We Turks are about 150-200.
Also a totally single state for the Turks is a bit imaginary I think. Maybe Turkistan might be a single state, but I think a EU like Turan is a possibility. So no need to change the Atatürk education system in Turkey.

[MUHLIS]

Interesting thoughts.
Sigma, I can hear what you mean, but creating such kind of military force is not physically possible. Can you imagine the reaction from the rest of the world, not to mention the obstacles of unification among muslim nations themselves. There is no United Bhuddist Forces, there is no United Christian Forces, so there should not be United Muslim forces as well. I think we have to think of something more creative to organize muslim nations into a sngle military block.
Unification of Turkistan without Islam is pointless!!! Islam lies in the core of the cultures of Turkic nation expect some such as gagauzs and siberian tribes. Secular government is OK, but the role of Islam in social and cultural life of people should not undermined.

[Sigma]

We have to ask the question: A secular Turan or not. I think that Arabs are the dominant power in the Islam world. So an Islamic unification will mean Arab uniication. Not because Quran is Arabic but also Arabs are about 400-500 million now. We Turks are about 150-200.
Also a totally single state for the Turks is a bit imaginary I think. Maybe Turkistan might be a single state, but I think a EU like Turan is a possibility. So no need to change the Atatürk education system in Turkey.

Not necessarily unification of Arabic speaking countries. The present situation is as such that we all have been sharing the same culture and religion, so there is a platform for some sort of unification(sort of Halifat). As for economic and other viable variables look no further to EU, NATO. They all were set up with the primary purpose of uniting Western countries. Why not the same for us, Muslim/Turcic/Arab countries?

[Sigma]

Interesting thoughts.
Sigma, I can hear what you mean, but creating such kind of military force is not physically possible. Can you imagine the reaction from the rest of the world, not to mention the obstacles of unification among muslim nations themselves. There is no United Bhuddist Forces, there is no United Christian Forces, so there should not be United Muslim forces as well. I think we have to think of something more creative to organize muslim nations into a sngle military block.
Unification of Turkistan without Islam is pointless!!! Islam lies in the core of the cultures of Turkic nation expect some such as gagauzs and siberian tribes. Secular government is OK, but the role of Islam in social and cultural life of people should not undermined.

When NATO formed the concern was so called Soviet factor. Nowadays the agenda fo NATO swiftly changed to tackling world(Islamic) terrorism. If you look at above mentioned military organisation, all the member countries are from west(i.e Christian). As for Turkey, she does not play major role, just a 3 column to Islamic world. So in fact there is already a one biased military organisation. Moreover, why not muslim forces? In that case, every muslim country will care for its neighbour, just look at Afghanistan. Instead NATO ground forces, which are daily attacked, muslim forces could have curbed all that mess.
By the way, there is already in existance African peacekeeping forces operating in Sudan, Ethiophia etc. So why not in Iraq etc?

[erk]

Not necessarily unification of Arabic speaking countries. The present situation is as such that we all have been sharing the same culture and religion, so there is a platform for some sort of unification(sort of Halifat). As for economic and other viable variables look no further to EU, NATO. They all were set up with the primary purpose of uniting Western countries. Why not the same for us, Muslim/Turcic/Arab countries?

Halifet will biring Arab domination. Arabs are more populated. I am not saying that Islam is useless. I am saying is a unification of Turks in needed, not Islamic countries.
I am Muslim but I am a Turk. I speak the Ural-Altaic language not Hami-Sami Arabic.

[asena]

First economically we should unite,after reaching to a satisfactory point,people will join themselves to a united country.Cause you know money,money,money

[kurshad]

There is no United Bhuddist Forces, there is no United Christian Forces, so there should not be United Muslim forces as well. I think we have to think of something more creative to organize muslim nations into a sngle military block.
Unification of Turkistan without Islam is pointless!!! Islam lies in the core of the cultures of Turkic nation expect some such as gagauzs and siberian tribes. Secular government is OK, but the role of Islam in social and cultural life of people should not undermined.

I agree totally..

[MUHLIS]

When NATO formed the concern was so called Soviet factor. Nowadays the agenda fo NATO swiftly changed to tackling world(Islamic) terrorism. If you look at above mentioned military organisation, all the member countries are from west(i.e Christian). As for Turkey, she does not play major role, just a 3 column to Islamic world. So in fact there is already a one biased military organisation. Moreover, why not muslim forces? In that case, every muslim country will care for its neighbour, just look at Afghanistan. Instead NATO ground forces, which are daily attacked, muslim forces could have curbed all that mess.
By the way, there is already in existance African peacekeeping forces operating in Sudan, Ethiophia etc. So why not in Iraq etc?
Sigma, my concerns about the current state of muslim dominated countries are similar to yours. The only thing I am telling you is slightly different approach to the issue. Like I mentioned before, none of the existing military blocks (at least openly) do not relate or associate themselves with any religion. Why should we? If we do so, the enemies of Islam will use it as "the next proof" to describe our religion as "violent". The idea is not bad at all though. On the other hand, big things begin with small efforts. There was ECO (I think it was Economic Cooperation organization) which involved Turkey, Iran, Afganistan, CARs, Pakistan, Azerbaijan, etc. But currently one can hardly hear anything about this organization.

[Aziz]

Shaik Abdulhameed Keshk(Egyptian)
said that there is an algebraic law says
arab-(minus)Islam=ZERO
and I say it is also applied for Turks
so any unification must be under Islam
Thanks

[Torcoman]

As Turkey is under control of EU and USA...

proove it!!! there will be a big attack to northern iraq even USA's worries. We will refuse E.U's offer about Turkey's public vote about EU summit. We wont need great powers like these, we need big Turkish countrie called Turkistan, Turkish Turks are very lonely becouse they feel like dervish, they cant see the power of unit of the Turks.

[Aybike]

Shaik Abdulhameed Keshk(Egyptian)
said that there is an algebraic law says
arab-(minus)Islam=ZERO
and I say it is also applied for Turks
so any unification must be under Islam
Thanks


heheheh arap şeyhi cebiri iyi bilmiş..ama sen beceremedin kardeş...
:lol:

[Torcoman]

Turcic nations, as well all the muslim nations HAVE TO SET UP rapid forces like NATO, and after that everybody will find us equal. Until then we are divided and perishable one by one, both culturally and socially. Think about UNITED MUSLIM FORCES/UMF. In the real world power comes first, then everything else. Agree???

united muslim forces??
it doesnt work, religions doesnt work to make a union of great power, it only works to hate christians or jews.

we have to think about Turkistan, becouse we are not Arab, and we dont believe Allah in arabic way, we really belive it in Turkish way. As you see in the examples of Ottoman Empire and modern Turkiye, we belive Kuran words, and we dont listen the words of Kuran from Usama or other guys, so its one of the difference between Turks and other nations.

(I dont hate Arabs but Muslims will never repair Arab's demage)

[Torcoman]

Not necessarily unification of Arabic speaking countries. The present situation is as such that we all have been sharing the same culture and religion, so there is a platform for some sort of unification(sort of Halifat). As for economic and other viable variables look no further to EU, NATO. They all were set up with the primary purpose of uniting Western countries. Why not the same for us, Muslim/Turcic/Arab countries?


Your right about what you say about united of Turkic nations.
But i cant agree with you in other words, becouse they are so dangerous
(arabic-turkic countrie? its like a nightmare)

[Torcoman]

yes ,it is a dream of uniting all those nations together !!! i think you guys didn't reallize the conflicts that exists among those nations !!but ,well try though!!!!


thank you for your pass,
turkistan project is such a stupid idea for you, than why are you in Turkistan forum?


you feel the real danger that coming, poor russians:(

[arjumanbey]

Arkadaslar Turk Birligi kurulsun diyosunuz ve kulaga cok hos geliyor ama,yapilan onceki girisimlerde bunujn olamayacagi anlasilmadi mi sizcede?Kurulan birlikte kabul gorecek olan diller,yonetim sekli,baskanlik donemi,ekonomik durumlar sorun olusturuyor bildigim kadari ile.

En onemlisi borc bataginda bulunan bir Turkiye ile kim birlesip,kendini atese atmak isterki?

Kimseyle tartismak icin yazmadim bu yaziyi,yanlis anlasilmasin.Bilmedigim seyler varsa lutfen banada aciklayin:)

[Aziz]

heheheh arap şeyhi cebiri iyi bilmiş..ama sen beceremedin kardeş...
:lol:

Brother Aybike
Please write in English because unfortunatly I only speak Arabic and English


can you translate what Aybike wrote?

[Administrator]

Aybike is not a brother but a sister(even a grandmother) ..(aybike = oyqiz )

why cant you speak uzbek language?

[Administrator]

guys did you forget tajikistan is also part of our region.besides that dont forget 25-30% population of tajikistan are ethnic uzbeks who have many relative ties with uzbekistan ,if tajiks are agree to name this union as "turkistan" then it is okey ,but i think political it is better to call it as 'central asian unioin'(like EU) instead of turkestan..coz tajiks think they are persian(but i doubt about that).we 5 countries of cenral asia can unite our economy ,military,,no need for russian and american military ..

[Aybike]

Arkadaslar Turk Birligi kurulsun diyosunuz ve kulaga cok hos geliyor ama,yapilan onceki girisimlerde bunujn olamayacagi anlasilmadi mi sizcede?Kurulan birlikte kabul gorecek olan diller,yonetim sekli,baskanlik donemi,ekonomik durumlar sorun olusturuyor bildigim kadari ile.

En onemlisi borc bataginda bulunan bir Turkiye ile kim birlesip,kendini atese atmak isterki?

Kimseyle tartismak icin yazmadim bu yaziyi,yanlis anlasilmasin.Bilmedigim seyler varsa lutfen banada aciklayin:)


peki türkiyeden daha iyi durumda olan başka bir türk cumhuriyeti varmı?
Borcu olmayan ve eğitiminin üst düzeyde olduğu..Merak soruyorum?

[Aybike]

Brother Aybike
Please write in English because unfortunatly I only speak Arabic and English


can you translate what Aybike wrote?

Kusura bakma aziz..2 senedir türkçe konuşuyor ve yazıyorum..inadım inat
yazmıcam ingilizce vede almanca..Sana tercüme eden olursa etsin ama bu ben olmayacağım..
Ben erkek değilim...bayanım ...sana tavsiyem türkçe öğren valla tadından yenmiyor bu dilin...Ben bir GÖNÜL kelimesinin her hangi bir yabancı dilde karşılığını bulduğum gün o dili konuşacağım...Yada SEVDA nın..Yada YÜREK..
Bilmem anlatabildimmi?

[dervish]

diyorsun ki
Turkiyenin borcu yoktur ve egitim duzeyide ust duzeydir...


peki türkiyeden daha iyi durumda olan başka bir türk cumhuriyeti varmı?
Borcu olmayan ve eğitiminin üst düzeyde olduğu..Merak soruyorum?

[erk]

peki türkiyeden daha iyi durumda olan başka bir türk cumhuriyeti varmı?
Borcu olmayan ve eğitiminin üst düzeyde olduğu..Merak soruyorum?

Ben özellikle Türkmenistanın Türkiyeden iyi düzeyde olduğunu düşünüyorum. Nüfus 5 6 milyon benim bildiğim borcu yok. Eğitim düzeyide Sovyetlerden beri yüksek düzeyde. Ayrıca "bağımsız" bir ülke yani tarafsız ben öyle biliyorum.

Yalnızca Saparmurat Türkmenbaşı birazcık garip diyelim. Tabi tam bir değerlendirme yapamam. Bu arada Karakumun ortasına göl kuracağım diyordu varmı bir gelişme?

[dervish]

Kuruyor.

Ayrica buzdan saray da yaptiracak.


Ben özellikle Türkmenistanın Türkiyeden iyi düzeyde olduğunu düşünüyorum. Nüfus 5 6 milyon benim bildiğim borcu yok. Eğitim düzeyide Sovyetlerden beri yüksek düzeyde. Ayrıca "bağımsız" bir ülke yani tarafsız ben öyle biliyorum.

Yalnızca Saparmurat Türkmenbaşı birazcık garip diyelim. Tabi tam bir değerlendirme yapamam. Bu arada Karakumun ortasına göl kuracağım diyordu varmı bir gelişme?

[erk]

Kuruyor.

Ayrica buzdan saray da yaptiracak.

Ciddenmi şaka mı? Ben cidden böyle birşey duymuştum. Yine başka projeleride vardı. Anlatsana biraz.

[Aziz]

Hi guys
I am a saudi citizen but I am originally from Uzbekistan
this is why I don't speak Uzbek
please brothers and sisters write in English


brothers and sisters don't forget east Turkistan which is under chinese control (Uoyghurs)
they are unbreakable part of Turkistan
Trkistan consists of Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Turkomanistan, Kazkistan,Kerghezistan and Eastrean Turkistan.
(6 million square kilometers full of muslims and fortunes must be liberated)

[Tangriberdi]

It sounds nice, however, how to do it?
1)
If there is no common language, you cannot do that! ( For now there is no such a language, what there is just languages of common ancestory.). The thing should be first done is to create a common language that all the speakers will agree on. (My opinion is thatAlphabet and writing system should be taken from Anatolian Turkish with some addition of nasal N, Q, Kh and A with umlaut from Turkmen, grammatical rules should be taken from Uzbek and Turkmen and vocabulary should be from Kazakh and Uyghur. In order to do that sounds of Kazakh should be adopted into a common Turkic. If that happens such a language may come into existance: MA"N BUL YOLLARDA YURGA"NDA" YASH AQARDI KO"ZLA"RIMDA"N, KO"ZLA"RIN"DA"N YASH AQAR MI?)
When I walked through that way, tears came out of my eyes, do tears come out of your(thy) eyes. )
And this language should be taught as a secondary language in the schools of all nations.
2). Co-operation among these countries should be established and should be strengthened. Culturally, Economically and Strategically. An advising council composed of members sent by those countries in an equal number should make a general structure of foreign policy and all Turkic states must follow it, in need, the countries must ask things to that council. This council should help Turkic states to solve bilateral or multilateral problems without permitting third states' interference.
A common military organization like NATO should be found and that will be a good step for the common army.
3-Consciousness of Turkishness as a super identity should be spread among all people and Pan Turkism should be a value among all of them. Islam should be respected and evaluated as a unifying essence and spirit. but not lead to be destinctive and decisive for things of administration.
4-If a unification came into existance, the capital city should be Turkistan( Esi) in my thought.there should be a relocation of populations in an amount that will make level of divergency equal. I may be make a wrong sentence I mean all people in all Turkic states be in equal number.
For example in Turkey there should be Kirgiz people Uzbek people and others and Turkey Turks should be in a number that Uzbeks in Turkey are in, Or Kyrgyz are in. How many Azerbaijani in Azerbaijan that Kazakh and Turkmen in Azerbaijan may be, how many Uzbek in Uzbekistan that many Uyghur in Uzbekistan, How many Uyghur in East Turkestan that many Anatolian Turk in East Turkestan.
That will prevent division and reseparation and will facilitate the acceptance of the new common language.
And Borders of today should be change after a unification in order to prevent separation desires.
E.g. Turkey's name should chane into Anatolia or something different and its borders should be in the Anatolian insula, further to east should be given to Azerbaijan and Azerbaijan should change its name into something different. And the same for Cental Asian territories.
Or
Turkey, Cyprus, Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan should take place in that union as a federal region under the title OGHUZELI, Kazakhstan and Kirgizistan as KYPCHAKELI Uzbekistan and Eat Turkestan as Chaghatay eli or something suchlike.
I may write so so so long. There are too many ideas in my mind about that but that is the beginning I will look for your comments

[dervish]

I think there is no need to create second Esperanto. As common language Turkish may be used.


It sounds nice, however, how to do it?
1)
If there is no common language, you cannot do that! ( For now there is no such a language, what there is just languages of common ancestory.). The thing should be first done is to create a common language that all the speakers will agree on. (My opinion is thatAlphabet and writing system should be taken from Anatolian Turkish with some addition of nasal N, Q, Kh and A with umlaut from Turkmen, grammatical rules should be taken from Uzbek and Turkmen and vocabulary should be from Kazakh and Uyghur. In order to do that sounds of Kazakh should be adopted into a common Turkic. If that happens such a language may come into existance: MA"N BUL YOLLARDA YURGA"NDA" YASH AQARDI KO"ZLA"RIMDA"N, KO"ZLA"RIN"DA"N YASH AQAR MI?)
When I walked through that way, tears came out of my eyes, do tears come out of your(thy) eyes. )
And this language should be taught as a secondary language in the schools of all nations.
2). Co-operation among these countries should be established and should be strengthened. Culturally, Economically and Strategically. An advising council composed of members sent by those countries in an equal number should make a general structure of foreign policy and all Turkic states must follow it, in need, the countries must ask things to that council. This council should help Turkic states to solve bilateral or multilateral problems without permitting third states' interference.
A common military organization like NATO should be found and that will be a good step for the common army.
3-Consciousness of Turkishness as a super identity should be spread among all people and Pan Turkism should be a value among all of them. Islam should be respected and evaluated as a unifying essence and spirit. but not lead to be destinctive and decisive for things of administration.
4-If a unification came into existance, the capital city should be Turkistan( Esi) in my thought.there should be a relocation of populations in an amount that will make level of divergency equal. I may be make a wrong sentence I mean all people in all Turkic states be in equal number.
For example in Turkey there should be Kirgiz people Uzbek people and others and Turkey Turks should be in a number that Uzbeks in Turkey are in, Or Kyrgyz are in. How many Azerbaijani in Azerbaijan that Kazakh and Turkmen in Azerbaijan may be, how many Uzbek in Uzbekistan that many Uyghur in Uzbekistan, How many Uyghur in East Turkestan that many Anatolian Turk in East Turkestan.
That will prevent division and reseparation and will facilitate the acceptance of the new common language.
And Borders of today should be change after a unification in order to prevent separation desires.
E.g. Turkey's name should chane into Anatolia or something different and its borders should be in the Anatolian insula, further to east should be given to Azerbaijan and Azerbaijan should change its name into something different. And the same for Cental Asian territories.
Or
Turkey, Cyprus, Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan should take place in that union as a federal region under the title OGHUZELI, Kazakhstan and Kirgizistan as KYPCHAKELI Uzbekistan and Eat Turkestan as Chaghatay eli or something suchlike.
I may write so so so long. There are too many ideas in my mind about that but that is the beginning I will look for your comments

[dervish]

benim baska bildigim.
Dunyadaki en buyuk camiilerden biri yapildi.
Birde 40milyon dolarlik bir universite binasi projesi var.

Ciddenmi şaka mı? Ben cidden böyle birşey duymuştum. Yine başka projeleride vardı. Anlatsana biraz.

[Tangriberdi]

I think there is no need to create second Esperanto. As common language Turkish may be used.
What you say is just like saying that abandon your independence and forget your culture and past.
A common language, depends on what you understand. I understand a common mother tongue but you may understand a common communication device between different nations like English and French.
I mean a language will be used bilingually along side with the national languages for a while (a while will last at least two generations) and then replace them, and will become only and primary mother tongue among all Turkic people by "a common mother tongue" not only a common language to understand each other in the best way, there is still such a common language among Central Asian languages. It is Russian, not Turkish.
I mean a language about which all Central Asian Turks, all Caucasian Turks and All Balkan Anatolian Cypriot, Iraqi, Iranian Turks can talk as "our language"
So if you think in that aspect of the fact, you cannot dictate Anatolian Turkish to all other Turks, this is wrong for that Turkish spoken in Turkey is a degenerated and deteriorated version of Turkic language and unfair for that if
we accept all Turks equal and partners not younger brothers and servants
And remember that Esperanto was created from nothing but a common mother language among Turks used to exist ages ago and that means it can be recreated and thus it is not comparable to Esperanto

[erk]

I think there is no need to create second Esperanto. As common language Turkish may be used.

Bence Türkmence olabilir hem Türkiye Türkçesine hemde Orta Asyadaki diğer lehçelere/dillere yakın.

[Tangriberdi]

Bence Türkmence olabilir hem Türkiye Türkçesine hemde Orta Asyadaki diğer lehçelere/dillere yakın.
Türkmence sözcük dağarı bakımından Türkçeye yakındır ama Diğer bütün dillerine palatalizasyon nedeniyle diğer bütün Türk dillerine uzaktır. Yani peltek s ve z leri telafuz ederler. Ben bir İran Türkmeni olarak bile, Annemin seslendirdiği bu peltek harfleri dillendiremiyorken bütün bir Türk dünyasının bunu başarması çok zor. Çünkü Türk dillerinde Türkmenceden başka pltek sesli dil yok.
Peltek olmayan seslerin işletildiği bir dil olması gerekirki bütün Türkler rahat konuşabilsin.
Dear friends what do you think about the things except language issue on the 35th post in that thread. I will be looking your views.

[Administrator]

If there is no common language, you cannot do that!

but there is a common language..
it is russian. if dont take into account turks and uygurs in china
russian is a common language of most turkic nations of the world
today.that is not common language in turkistan but
that is also the tool to communicate with tatars(with all kind) and with
our siberian turkic brothers like sahas and tuvas(we can also add gagavuzes
and azeris and some caucasion turkics here).personally i and rest om my
nation have no problems in comunicating with kazaks, kirgizs,tajiks and
with sahas(yakuts) just because we speak russian.so i cant see any language
barrier problems,today many tatar web sites propaganding panturkizm in
russian language and they have did alot of job among kazahs and tatars who
speak russian as a native.
Tangriberdi i think for nowadays turkeys panturkists it shuold be in first
place thing to learn russian language to better understand rest of the
turkic world,is not it?your opinion..

[erk]

but there is a common language..
it is russian. if dont take into account turks and uygurs in china
russian is a common language of most turkic nations of the world
today.that is not common language in turkistan but
that is also the tool to communicate with tatars(with all kind) and with
our siberian turkic brothers like sahas and tuvas(we can also add gagavuzes
and azeris and some caucasion turkics here).personally i and rest om my
nation have no problems in comunicating with kazaks, kirgizs,tajiks and
with sahas(yakuts) just because we speak russian.so i cant see any language
barrier problems,today many tatar web sites propaganding panturkizm in
russian language and they have did alot of job among kazahs and tatars who
speak russian as a native.
Tangriberdi i think for nowadays turkeys panturkists it shuold be in first
place thing to learn russian language to better understand rest of the
turkic world,is not it?your opinion..

But this Russian hegemony will lead us to where? Will it continue forever? I dont find Russian being a common language among Turks logical. They invaded your lands, killed millions of Muslim Turks, ok maybe the Socialists regime may have given you something, but Russian isnt one of these or musnt be. To be totally independence we must create or accept a common language. Uzbek maybe a common language maybe?

[erk]

benim baska bildigim.
Dunyadaki en buyuk camiilerden biri yapildi.
Birde 40milyon dolarlik bir universite binasi projesi var.

Göktepeye yapıldı değilmi cami, savaşın olduğu yere, Ruslarla.

[Bilge_Kagan]

Bana gore Mustafa Cokay(Kazak Turkistan bagimsizlikcisi. Omrunu bu yolda tuketti. Kaynak icin: Turkistan Atesi-Abdulvahap Kara ) ve taifesi tarafindan "Yas Turkistan" dergisinin cikarildigi sirada ortaya konulan " Cagatayca " biraz guncellestirilerek rahatca konusulabilir. Dogu Turkistandaki kardeslerimizin anlayabilecegini sanmiyorum ama butun Bati ( Cagatay ) Turkleri, bu derginin dili olan Cagataycayi anlayabiliyordu. Bu dilin yapisal ozelliklerini yarin sabaha ( gercekten cok yorgunum ) biraz arastirip buraya yazarim insallah...

[Administrator]

But this Russian hegemony will lead us to where? Will it continue forever? I dont find Russian being a common language among Turks logical. They invaded your lands, killed millions of Muslim Turks, ok maybe the Socialists regime may have given you something, but Russian isnt one of these or musnt be. To be totally independence we must create or accept a common language. Uzbek maybe a common language maybe?

hehehe...knowing and speaking russian language will not lead us to russian hegemony ,besides that
if you see russians as our enemies then so there is wise uzbek saying like "to know your enemy better you must know his language" in uzbek "dushmaningni yahshiroq bilish uchun uni tilini bilishing kerak" so no problems with rusisan language in ths case my friend ..
uzbek or uygur languages can not be common languages coz they are heavily understood among kipchaks and oguzs.

[erk]

hehehe...knowing and speaking russian language will not lead us to russian hegemony ,besides that
if you see russians as our enemies then so there is wise uzbek saying like "to know your enemy better you must know his language" in uzbek "dushmaningni yahshiroq bilish uchun uni tilini bilishing kerak" so no problems with rusisan language in ths case my friend ..
uzbek or uygur languages can not be common languages coz they are heavily understood among kipchaks and oguzs.
Well I dont see Russians as totally enemies, but I am sure that they are not friends. What am I saying is respect to ancestors, Ata's (grandfathers). Miilions died because of Russian invasion. Talking always Russiand means in a swearing to them. Its in a way praying in Church as a Musliam without being Christian. Time will tell what will happen.

[Aziz]

I may do not know very much about the languages out there (Turkistan) but logically it is impossible to have completely different languges between two nieghbour countries
I think what you consider is a single language in each country is only a dialect of the mother language. You may don't understand each other because there is no communication between you. For example, the Saudi arabs hardly understand the Moroccan Arabs because they are far away and there is no media communication between them although they sreak the same language.


please tell me if I was wrong

[nokia]

hold on look i was born in uzbekistan but i dont speak uzbek only russian,english and hebrew by the way i'm jewish so i'm turk????????????.........

[erk]

I may do not know very much about the languages out there (Turkistan) but logically it is impossible to have completely different languges between two nieghbour countries
I think what you consider is a single language in each country is only a dialect of the mother language. You may don't understand each other because there is no communication between you. For example, the Saudi arabs hardly understand the Moroccan Arabs because they are far away and there is no media communication between them although they sreak the same language.


please tell me if I was wrong

If I am not mistaken Arabs have a common language, I mean an offical language which all Arabs know. But they also speak their own Arabic at their countries.

[Torcoman]

hold on look i was born in uzbekistan but i dont speak uzbek only russian,english and hebrew by the way i'm jewish so i'm turk????????????.........

who claim that?
Turks are one of greatest civilations in the history. If you dont fell like a Turk, it wont be hurt other Turks. You are free to feel whatever you want.
But dont forget, theres thousand jewish Turks living in Turkey and they feel the real feelings about being Turk, and they are proud of being Turk.

[nokia]

who claim that?
Turks are one of greatest civilations in the history. If you dont fell like a Turk, it wont be hurt other Turks. You are free to feel whatever you want.
But dont forget, theres thousand jewish Turks living in Turkey and they feel the real feelings about being Turk, and they are proud of being Turk.


i know that it has a lot of jews turk in turkey but i dont know if i'm turk and what is the countries of turkisan??????....

[Aziz]

If I am not mistaken Arabs have a common language, I mean an offical language which all Arabs know. But they also speak their own Arabic at their countries.


You are right brother erk but when a moroccan talk to another moroccan the saudi can't understand him.
but when the same person talk to the saudi they can understand each other. The moroccan dialect is difficult for arabs in the east.

[Tangriberdi]

but there is a common language..
it is russian...
Tangriberdi i think for nowadays turkeys panturkists it shuold be in first
place thing to learn russian language to better understand rest of the
turkic world,is not it?your opinion..
As I referred in my previous messages, yes Russian is still a common device (language) of communication among Turkish nations, which is a current situation for former Turkic members of Great Soviet Empire. That is true!
But that is similar to African countries of present time, they speak English and there is almost no linguistic problem due to massive use of English. As a matter of fact this is a remnant of imperialistic era, and those states which were once colonized.
I think you understand what I am trying to say. If you will preserve Russian forever as the initial and primary language of communication and pretend to keep the memory of Russian occupation in your lands, as you wish !!! I have no word to say for this. As I have just said, AS YOU WISH!!!
But what I am talking about someting very new, something very original and something belonging to us, which we can feel consent when we say that it is ours. It is something will reunite us, something which will mean a lot for us, be a source of pride, be a story of our achievement, begin a new era in terms of our authentic concept of independence and sense of partnership, sisterhood and consciousness of oneness. Thinking about that and getting enthusiastic about it are so dificult? Or it is easier to be unwilling for that? You choose.

[dervish]

Not "Great Soviet Empire"
It is "Union of Soviet Socialist Republics" - "Soviet Sosyalist Cumhuriyetler Birligi"


As I referred in my previous messages, yes Russian is still a common device (language) of communication among Turkish nations, which is a current situation for former Turkic members of Great Soviet Empire. That is true!
But that is similar to African countries of present time, they speak English and there is almost no linguistic problem due to massive use of English. As a matter of fact this is a remnant of imperialistic era, and those states which were once colonized.
I think you understand what I am trying to say. If you will preserve Russian forever as the initial and primary language of communication and pretend to keep the memory of Russian occupation in your lands, as you wish !!! I have no word to say for this. As I have just said, AS YOU WISH!!!
But what I am talking about someting very new, something very original and something belonging to us, which we can feel consent when we say that it is ours. It is something will reunite us, something which will mean a lot for us, be a source of pride, be a story of our achievement, begin a new era in terms of our authentic concept of independence and sense of partnership, sisterhood and consciousness of oneness. Thinking about that and getting enthusiastic about it are so dificult? Or it is easier to be unwilling for that? You choose.

[erk]

You are right brother erk but when a moroccan talk to another moroccan the saudi can't understand him.
but when the same person talk to the saudi they can understand each other. The moroccan dialect is difficult for arabs in the east.

Yes brother Aziz but in official they have a common language. This is very important. We Turks must have a common language.

[Tangriberdi]

Not "Great Soviet Empire"
It is "Union of Soviet Socialist Republics" - "Soviet Socialist Cumhuriyetler Birligi"
Hey did not you ever heard about something called Irony?
By the way I speak Turkish as fluently as I can know about the Turkish name of the USSR , though it is my second language. I can also speak enough English as my third language. Thanks for your quotation. That warning by you insulted me. I am waiting for an apology.:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

[dervish]

Don't take it as insult. It was a correction.

about languages
Turkmen: My native language
Turkish: I Know it much better than many people in Turkey
English: Also my third
Russian: I read, speak, write and understand it


Hey did not you ever heard about something called Irony?
By the way I speak Turkish as fluently as I can know about the Turkish name of the USSR , though it is my second language. I can also speak enough English as my third language. Thanks for your quotation. That warning by you insulted me. I am waiting for an apology.:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

[Tangriberdi]

i know that it has a lot of jews turk in turkey but i dont know if i'm turk and what is the countries of turkisan??????....
The first, not Turkisan but Turkistan.
Turkistan is a historical region including Sinkiang Uyghur Autonomous Region of China(formerly called Eastern Turkistan), Bashkiria and Tatarstan in Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and North of Afghanistan (makes the western part of Turkistan). Also they are also called Chinese Turkistan and Russian Turkistan

[Tangriberdi]

Don't take it as insult. It was a correction.

about languages
Turkmen: My native language
Turkish: I Know it much better than many people in Turkey
English: Also my third
Russian: I read, speak, write and understand it
about languages
Turkmen(Iranian):My mother tongue
Turkish:my native language, secondly learnt
Persian:I know a Khorasani dialect of it, not so good.
English: I am a translator.
Please check Neden Yabancı Öğrenciler out I wrote something there in my Turkmen dialect. I want to see whether you can understand or not.

[nokia]

The first, not Turkisan but Turkistan.
Turkistan is a historical region including Sinkiang Uyghur Autonomous Region of China(formerly called Eastern Turkistan), Bashkiria and Tatarstan in Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and North of Afghanistan (makes the western part of Turkistan). Also they are also called Chinese Turkistan and Russian Turkistan

thank u very much 4 the information and 1 more question: what is the differents between turks and arabs???..

[Kur_Sad]

Turandan Birleşik Türkistan'dan bahsediyorsunuz ama bunu güzel Türkçemizle yapmıyorsunuz:( Sanırım herkes Türkçe biliyor

Please TURKISH;)

[cool-gafur]

hold on look i was born in uzbekistan but i dont speak uzbek only russian,english and hebrew by the way i'm jewish so i'm turk????????????.........same thing for me .I was born in uzbekistan my parents are divorced Iim mixed i will never say that im a turk . guess everyone that lives in uzbekistan must learn uzbek . uzbekistan is simply one other very rare country in asia .---edited---.thats like saying hawaii is europe.
Im going to learn uzbek perfectly .

[Jwel]

You are right brother erk but when a moroccan talk to another moroccan the saudi can't understand him.
but when the same person talk to the saudi they can understand each other. The moroccan dialect is difficult for arabs in the east.
My dear Aziz

The only reason why no one can understand Moroccans simply cause they don't speak Arabic , yes the main language is Arabic yet what widely use are Tachelhit, Tamazight and Tarifit
which all are part of Berber culture , that's why when someone from SA speaks arabic every one can understand him/her in spite of the heavy Gulf accent cause he/she speaks Arabic ;)

[Jwel]

same thing for me .I was born in uzbekistan my parents are divorced Iim mixed i will never say that im a turk . guess everyone that lives in uzbekistan must learn uzbek . uzbekistan is simply one other very rare country in asia .---edited---.thats like saying hawaii is europe.
Im going to learn uzbek perfectly .

Don't worry ,we don't want you to be a Turk either:rolleyes:

[Pax]

My dear Aziz

The only reason why no one can understand Moroccans simply cause they don't speak Arabic , yes the main language is Arabic yet what widely use are Tachelhit, Tamazight and Tarifit
which all are part of Berber culture , that's why when someone from SA speaks arabic every one can understand him/her in spite of the heavy Gulf accent cause he/she speaks Arabic ;)
That's interesting.. And what constitutes this distinctive "Gulf" accent? What makes it different from other vernacular and standard dialect?

[Jwel]

That's interesting.. And what constitutes this distinctive "Gulf" accent? What makes it different from other vernacular and standard dialect?

Welcome back sweetie
SA Arabic well known as Hijazi, which is the influence of the desert, and the bedouin culture that what make it different , and a bit heavy , it's hard to understand it sometimes specially with nomads , I tried to learn from them , but it was a hard task , yet I can speak now with a Gulf accent ,I can fool any one but not a nomad of course :shock:


Funny with Arabic is the accent you can have different accents in the same one country , every region has it own vocabulary , that's why if you ever consider learning Arabic it much easier to learn the formal language, but for sure without Grammar, cause I know for sure the Arabic Grammar is one of the hardest ever,:?

[Aziz]

Dear Jwel

I'm Saudi citizen. So I know how moroccan, egyptian and other Arabs speak. But the point is Saudi can't understand Moroccan because there is no powerfull connectin between them. The same thing can be said to the people of Turkistan in their various countries.
Thanks

Aziz

[cool-gafur]

Don't worry ,we don't want you to be a Turk either:rolleyes:Im quarter asian anyway so I cant even be something thats not what I am

[Torcoman]

Im quarter asian anyway so I cant even be something thats not what I am

what a demage for us!!:D

[Tabriz_Han]

Sigma
Not necessarily unification of Arabic speaking countries. The present situation is as such that we all have been sharing the same culture and religion, so there is a platform for some sort of unification(sort of Halifat). As for economic and other viable variables look no further to EU, NATO. They all were set up with the primary purpose of uniting Western countries. Why not the same for us, Muslim/Turcic/Arab countries


Very important points have been raised.

I would love to see a union of Muslim nations, there shouldnt be a fear that it will just be an Arab union because the total Arab world population is not much higher than the Turk one or Pakistani/Indian Muslims or South East Asia Muslims.

Now the current world poses big problems and players who try to prevent this happening.

This is why I see a Union of Turk states to be essential and one which must be supported by all Muslim Nations.

The reason is, is that in todays world this target is achievable, there is nothing which can stop the people mobilising and forming a Union of States.

In addition we share a common language, most can understand each other and a few weeks language lesson in each one would make us 100% fluent in understanding all.

We are all Musluman nations.

We share cultural values, historical ties and many similarities.

Infact a Union of Turk states would be far more logical, easier to implement, uphold and embrace brother/sisterhood than the EU. In the EU there is not a common understandable language, there is not one religion, there is not similar culture or values, there is not a sense of brotherhood or love between most these nations and they actually have very little in common. In history Europe has always fought itself, wether it be Germans vs English, English vs French, German vs Pole etc etc

If the EU can achieve this among nations extremely hostile to one another then I really believe that Turk nations can achieve this all it takes is a few great leaders, dedication and hard work and at the end we will all benefit.

I believe Turkistan should unite or form a federation of states, with Turkiye, Azerbeycan and Turkish Cyprus. From this state we can make strong allies with friendly Muslim states, Pakistan, Afganistan, Balkan Muslim states, Caucaus Muslim states/semi dependant states, South Eastern Asian Muslim states.

A Turk union is essential for all Turks and Muslims of the world. We can then bring Russia to its knees and free our oppressed brothers in Karabag, Chechneya, Daghestan, Tataristan, Tuva........ also make Christian Nations think twice before thinking they can attack Muslim nations and slaughter our people. We will be very powerfull and with co-operation with our Muslim world we can rise from the division the Imperialists caused and Unite.

BIRLIKDEN GUC DOGAR

BIRLESHIK TURK DOVLETLERI GERCEKLESECEK

[Amiri Turkiston]

Отдельные классификации тюркских языков

КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ Г. РАМСТЕДА
Н.З. Гаджиева. Тюркские языки. // Лингвистический энциклопедический словарь. - М., 1990. - С. 527-529)

Чувашский язык;
Якутский язык;
Северная группа: все тюркские языки и диалекты Алтая и прилегающих районов;
Западная группа: киргизский, казахский, каракалпакский, ногайский, кумыкский, карачаевский, балкарский, караимский, татарский и башкирский языки, к этой же группе отнесены и мертвые куманский и кыпчакский языки;
Восточная группа: новоуйгурский и узбекский языки;
Южная группа: туркменский, азербайджанский, турецкий и гагаузский языки.КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ В.В. РАДЛОВА
Н.З. Гаджиева. Тюркские языки. // Лингвистический энциклопедический словарь. - М., 1990. - С. 527-529)

Восточная группа: языки и диалекты алтайских, обских, енисейских тюрок и чулымских татар, карагасский, хакасский, шорский и тувинский языки;
Западная группа: наречия татар Западной Сибири, киргизский, казахский, башкирский, татарский и, условно, каракалпакский языки;
Среднеазиатская группа: уйгурский и узбекский языки;
Южная группа: туркменский, азербайджанский, турецкий языки, некоторые южнобережные говоры крымскотатарского языка;
Якутский язык особо.КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ А.Н. САМОЙЛОВИЧА, 1922
Самойлович А.Н. Некоторые дополнения к классификации турецких языков. Петербург, 1922

Булгарская, или "р"-группа: булгарский и чувашский языки;
Уйгурская, или "д"-группа (иначе северо-восточная): древнеуйгурский, тувинский, тофаларский, якутский, хакасский языки;
Кыпчакская, или "тау"-группа (иначе северо-западная): татарский, башкирский, казахский, киргизский языки, алтайский язык и его диалекты, карачаево-балкарский, кумыкский, крымскотатарский языки;
Чагатайская, или "таг-лык"-группа (иначе юго-восточная): современный уйгурский язык, узбекский язык без его кыпчакских диалектов;
Кыпчакско-туркменская, или "таг-лы" группа: промежуточные говоры - хивинско-узбекские и хивинско-сартские, утратившие самостоятельное значение;
Огузская, или "ол"-группа (иначе юго-западная): турецкий, азербайджанский, туркменский, южнобережные крымскотатарские диалекты.КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ В.А. БОГОРОДИЦКОГО, 1934
Богородицкий В.А. Введение в татарское языкознание. Казань, 1934.

Северо-восточная - якутский, карагасский и тувинский языки;
Хакасская (абаканская) - сагайский, бельтирский, койбальский, качинский и кызыльский говоры хакасского населения региона;
Алтайская - с южной ветвью: алтайский и телеутский языки и северной ветвью: диалекты т.н. черневых татар и некоторые другие;
Западно-сибирская - все диалекты сибирских татар;
Поволжско-приуральская - татарский и башкирский языки;
Среднеазиатская - уйгурский, казахский, киргизский, узбекский, каракалпакский языки;
Юго-западная - туркменский, азербайджанский, кумыкский, гагаузский и турецкий языки.КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ Н.А.БАСКАКОВА, 1960
Баскаков Н.А. Тюркские языки. М., 1960.
ЗАПАДНО-ХУННСКАЯ ВЕТВЬ
I. Булгарская группа
1. чувашский;
2. булгарский (мертвый);
3. хазарский (мертвый);
II. Огузская группа
а) огузско-туркменская подгруппа
1. туркменский;
2. трухменский;
3. oгузский Х-ХI вв. (Махмуд Кашгарский) (мертвый);
б) огузско-булгарская подгруппа
1. гагаузский;
2. печенежский (мертвый);
3. yзский (мертвый);
в) огузско-сельжукская подгруппа
1. турецкий (османский);
2. азербайжанский;
3. сельжукский (мертвый);
4. староосманский (мертвый);
III. Кыпчакская группа
а) кыпчако-булгарская подгруппа
1. татарский (касимовские, мишарские и др. диалекты);
2. башкирский;
3. западный золотоордынский (мертвый);
б) кыпчакско-огузская подгруппа
1. караимский;
2. кумыкский;
3. половецкий (куманский) (мертвый);
в) кыпчакско-ногайская подгруппа
1. ногайский;
2. каракалпакский;
3. казахский;
IV. Карлукская группа
а) карлукско-уйгурская подгруппа
1. язык Караханидского государства (по памятникам "Диван лугат ат-турки", "Кудатгу билиг") (мертвый);
2. язык после Караханидского периoда (мертвый);
б) карлукско-хорезмийская подгруппа
1. узбекский;
2. уйгурский;
3. карлукско-хорезмийский (мертвый);
4. староузбекский (мертвый);
ВОСТОЧНО-ХУННСКАЯ ВЕТВЬ
I. Уйгурская группа
а) уйгурско-тукюйская подгруппа
1. тувинский;
2. карагаский;
б) якутская подгруппа
1. якутский (с долганским);
в) хакасская группа
1. хакасский;
2. камасинский;
3. кюэринский;
4. шорский;
5. туба, куманды и др. северные диалекты алтайского языка;
6. сары-уйгурский (язык "желтых уйгур");
II. Киргизско-кыпчакская группа
1. киргизский;
2. алтайский;
КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ М.Т. ДЬЯЧКА ПО МЕТОДУ ГЛОТТОХРОНОЛОГИИ
М.Т. Дьячок. Глоттохронология тюркских языков (Предварительный анализ). // Материалы Второй научной конференции - Новосибирск, 2001. - С. 14-16

Якутская подгруппа: якутский, долганский;
Тувинская подгруппа: тувинский, тофаларский;
Булгарская подгруппа: чувашский;
Западная подгруппа: татарский, башкирский, казахский, кыргызский, турецкий, туркменский, азербайджанский, хакасский, саларский и все остальные тюркские языки.
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SHOR [CJS] (Russia (Asia))
DOLGAN [DLG] (Russia (Asia))
KARAGAS [KIM] (Russia (Asia))
KHAKAS [KJH] (Russia (Asia))
TUVIN [TUN] (Russia (Asia))
YAKUT [UKT] (Russia (Asia))
SOUTHERN:
Azerbaijani:
AZERBAIJANI, SOUTH [AZB] (Iran)
AZERBAIJANI, NORTH [AZE] (Azerbaijan)
KHALAJ [KLJ] (Iran)
QASHQA'I [QSQ] (Iran)
SALCHUQ [SLQ] (Iran)
CRIMEAN TURKISH [CRH] (Uzbekistan)
SALAR [SLR] (China)
Turkish:
BALKAN GAGAUZ TURKISH [BGX] (Turkey (Europe))
GAGAUZ [GAG] (Moldova)
KHORASANI TURKISH [KMZ] (Iran)
TURKISH [TRK] (Turkey (Asia))
Turkmenian:
TURKMEN [TCK] (Turkmenistan)
WESTERN:
Aralo-Caspian:
KARAKALPAK [KAC] (Uzbekistan)
KAZAKH [KAZ] (Kazakhstan)
KIRGHIZ [KDO] (Kyrgyzstan)
NOGAI [NOG] (Russia (Europe))
Ponto-Caspian:
JUDEO-CRIMEAN TATAR [JCT] (Uzbekistan)
KARAIM [KDR] (Lithuania)
KARACHAY-BALKAR [KRC] (Russia (Europe))
KUMYK [KSK] (Russia (Europe))
Uralian:
BASHKIR [BXK] (Russia (Europe))
CHULYM [CHU] (Russia (Asia))
TATAR [TTR] (Russia (Europe))
URUM [UUM]

[Amiri Turkiston]

КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ Т. ТЕКИНА (ТУРЦИЯ)

Т. Текин. Проблема классификации тюркских языков // Проблемы современной тюркологии: материалы II Всесоюзной тюркологической конференции. - Алма-Ата: Наука, 1980 - С. 387-390
Классификация тюркских языков должна основываться на шести фонетических критериях, а именно:
1) r / z и l / š;
2) ф > h-, ф;
3) γ > t; d, z / iy;
4) -ïγ > ïγ / -u / -ū, -ïq / -ï;
5) aγ > aw / aγ;
6) t > t // d.

Согласно этим критериям, тюркские языки делятся на следующие 12 групп:
I группа r / l : чувашский язык.
II группа hadaq: халаджский язык.
III группа atax: якутский язык.
IV группа adaq: тувинский язык (включая карагашский).
V группа azaq:

1-я подгруппа ŏazil: хакасский язык;
2-я подгруппа čažil: среднечулымский язык, мрасский, верхнетомский языки;
3-я подгруппа yasil: язык желтых уйгуров;
VI группа taγlïγ: североалтайские диалекты, кондомский, нижнетомский языки.
VII группа tūlu: алтайский (южные диалекты).
VIII группа tōlū: киргизский язык.
IX группа taγlïq:
1-я подгруппа aγiz: узбекский язык.
2-я подгруппа eγiz: новоуйгурский язык.
X группа tawli:
1-я подгруппа qos:
a) žil: казахский и каракалпакский языки,
б) ¥il: ногайский язык и халичский диалект кара-калпакского языка;
2-я подгруппа qōs:
a) per: язык барабинских татар,
б) ber:
1) jol: карачаево-балкарский, крымско-татарский (северные диалекты),
2) yol:
a) kel:
toquz: хорезмский диалект узбекского языка,
toγuz: караимский (транайский диалект),
doquz: крымско-татарский (южные диалекты),
б) qel: кумыкский язык.
XI группа taγli: саларский язык.
XII группа daγli:
1-я подгруппа gāl:
а) öb: туркменский язык,
б) e°z: хорасанский диалект;
2-я подгруппа gāl: хорезмско-огузский диалект узбекского языка;
3-я подгруппа ğal: азербайджанский язык;
4-я подгруппа qal:
a) ev: турецкий язык;
б) yev: гагаузский язык.

[Qizilbash]

КЛАССИФИКАЦИЯ Т. ТЕКИНА (ТУРЦИЯ)

Т. Текин. Проблема классификации тюркских языков // Проблемы современной тюркологии: материалы II Всесоюзной тюркологической конференции. - Алма-Ата: Наука, 1980 - С. 387-390
Классификация тюркских языков должна основываться на шести фонетических критериях, а именно:
1) r / z и l / š;
2) ф > h-, ф;
3) γ > t; d, z / iy;
4) -ïγ > ïγ / -u / -ū, -ïq / -ï;
5) aγ > aw / aγ;
6) t > t // d.

Согласно этим критериям, тюркские языки делятся на следующие 12 групп:
I группа r / l : чувашский язык.
II группа hadaq: халаджский язык.
III группа atax: якутский язык.
IV группа adaq: тувинский язык (включая карагашский).
V группа azaq:

1-я подгруппа ŏazil: хакасский язык;
2-я подгруппа čažil: среднечулымский язык, мрасский, верхнетомский языки;
3-я подгруппа yasil: язык желтых уйгуров;
VI группа taγlïγ: североалтайские диалекты, кондомский, нижнетомский языки.
VII группа tūlu: алтайский (южные диалекты).
VIII группа tōlū: киргизский язык.
IX группа taγlïq:
1-я подгруппа aγiz: узбекский язык.
2-я подгруппа eγiz: новоуйгурский язык.
X группа tawli:
1-я подгруппа qos:
a) žil: казахский и каракалпакский языки,
б) ¥il: ногайский язык и халичский диалект кара-калпакского языка;
2-я подгруппа qōs:
a) per: язык барабинских татар,
б) ber:
1) jol: карачаево-балкарский, крымско-татарский (северные диалекты),
2) yol:
a) kel:
toquz: хорезмский диалект узбекского языка,
toγuz: караимский (транайский диалект),
doquz: крымско-татарский (южные диалекты),
б) qel: кумыкский язык.
XI группа taγli: саларский язык.
XII группа daγli:
1-я подгруппа gāl:
а) öb: туркменский язык,
б) e°z: хорасанский диалект;
2-я подгруппа gāl: хорезмско-огузский диалект узбекского языка;
3-я подгруппа ğal: азербайджанский язык;
4-я подгруппа qal:
a) ev: турецкий язык;
б) yev: гагаузский язык.

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