Iran president wants Israel wiped off the map [Archive] - Uzbekistan Online Forum

Guardian

10-26-2005, 01:32 PM

Ahmadinejad says new wave of Palestinian attacks will destroy Israel
Updated: 7:31 a.m. ET Oct. 26, 2005

TEHRAN, Iran - Iran’s hard-line president called for Israel to be ”wiped off the map” and said a new wave of Palestinian attacks will destroy the Jewish state, state-run media reported Wednesday.

”There is no doubt that the new wave (of attacks) in Palestine will wipe off this stigma (Israel) from the face of the Islamic world,” Ahmadinejad told students Wednesday during a Tehran conference called ”The World without Zionism.”

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9823624/

I think we need to allow Iran to push forward with its peaceful intentions of enriching uranium, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that Iran is peaceful and would never use nuclear weapons offensively against humanity.Hope to hear from Guardian and Black.
Go to http://news.google.com. Type "Ahmadinejad, Israel" in search box and click on "Search news". The stories as above are plenty. Check the sources who are writing these sorts of score-pointing, propaganda stories and advice me, please, whom I can trust. These are called preparation for war, done by few m******er masterminds. They are brainwashing guys outta there in the states. (as they did about WMD, Iraq, Bin Laden etc. fairy tales) Their only and just intention is to detract Iran's image among world public. To gain support to fight against another stable country in Middle East. (Iraq, Iran, and soon third one is probably gonna be Syria) They are danger to Israel!!!

As on topic, I do acknowledge Ahmadinajed acted foolish. By saying these kind of message he will encourage world politicians to keep away from him, not to integrate or co-operate with Iran, if not with Muslim people. He is not a smart man, IMO, he was a member of a bunch of hooligans, who brought the undemocratic system in power. (Revolution of 1979) IMO

UzLand

10-26-2005, 02:54 PM

Black

10-27-2005, 02:53 AM

stanford before making some sarcasm, try to understand what is telling/told your opponent.
1) Iran,as any other country, has a right to enrich uranium. It is written in international packs, treaties and etc.,
2) What Iran's atomic energy station has to do with what Ahmadinajed said?

I am not big fan of Iran or iranians. As any other nation in the world they have their interests. Be it as strong as US or Russia, Iran would have tried to influence CA countries. I am sure about that. BUT, as an independent state Iran has a right to enrich uranium for its atomic stations. (IMHO, even it has a right to produce Nuclear weapons, as long as it is not transferred to any other country or organisation).

As for the Ahmadinajad's statement about "wiping out Israel" it is not first such kind of statement made by Iranian politicians. So what? And Iranian politicians will make such statements in the future for sure. Iranians are Iranians.
How the hell you defend Israel? Israel is a terrorist state, stole Palastinians land. It is like Hitler's Germany.
Actually, I don't care what Ahmadinejad or anybody else say about Israel. It is all show. BUT, What Ahmadinejad said has nothing to do with Iran's plans to produce nuclear energy.
According to you, because the US killing muslims in worldwide it has no right to produce nuclear energy for its citizens in America?

Lame argument. Bring me something challenging about Irans right to enrich uranium from reliable source (not american neo con msnbc)

Black

10-27-2005, 02:56 AM

LOOL, did you read it (news) yourself? Where it says that "Iran is planning to wipe out Israel"? I can also say such statement, like "America to be wiped out" or "America must be wiped out", but that does not mean that I am going to wipe out America myself or my country is going to wipe out America.
And besides this, just read the news headlines (before making your very "bright" conclusions), it says: Ahmadinejad says new wave of Palestinian attacks will destroy Israel.
So what a new wave of Palestiniaan attacks to do with Iran's nuclear enrichment plans?

LOOOOL, what a lame argument.

Guardian

10-27-2005, 03:01 AM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4378948.stm

Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom his country regarded Iran as "a clear and present danger". Mr Shalom said it was clear that Iran was trying to develop a programme to make nuclear weapons.

FYI: http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article322539.ece

Israel should be wiped off map, says Iran's president
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,1601414,00.html

Ahmadenajed made the same type of message as G Bush does, or Tony did.

(IMO. Ahmadenejad should calm down, to avoid isolating Iran''s foreing policy with the west. Hugo Chavez could teach him how to behave if they could reach a deal)

MUHLIS

10-27-2005, 06:01 AM

I agree with the statements of Guardian in general. However, I do not think Iranian government itself is so innocent. I do not know much about Iranian politics and sometimes I canot understand them. One day Islamic republic of Iran is posing itself as the furious Jew-hater and protector of Palestinian state and the next day cooperating with Armenia and Russia to marginalize independent Azerbaijan...When Karabakh violence erupted Iran was on the Armenian side.

Gareeb

10-27-2005, 07:14 AM

I am not pro or antiIranian however I would love to see the Israyeli State wiped out from Palestine.

infolife

10-27-2005, 07:41 AM

I was discussing this issue with some1 yesterday.He says although the conflict dates back to the years after world war 2,it didn't get that bloody till Reagon became the president of the US. I didn't know that much about him and he keeps saying how he supported Jews and encouraged war b/w muslims and jews there:rolleyes:
Is that true?

Gareeb

10-27-2005, 07:51 AM

infolife

10-27-2005, 08:04 AM

reformer,can u bring up some facts as well?:rolleyes:
When,where,what did he do in Middle East???
Yeah he was the most hated ,most loved president of Us.

Gareeb

10-27-2005, 08:10 AM

reformer,can u bring up some facts as well?:rolleyes:
When,where,what did he do in Middle East???
There area loads of facts.It is not all about Reagen , I mean US foreign policy towards middle east not depend on any certain president, it is already fixed.

infolife

10-27-2005, 08:17 AM

reformer, I made it clear that I need exactly what Reagon did,the exact facts of his bloody attempts in ME. if u have no answers,pls don't post!

I know what us policy is about.

There area loads of facts.It is not all about Reagen , I mean US foreign policy towards middle east not depend on any certain president, it is already fixed.

tarafdor

10-27-2005, 08:40 AM

Go to http://news.google.com. Type "Ahmadinejad, Israel" in search box and click on "Search news". The stories as above are plenty. Check the sources who are writing these sorts of score-pointing, propaganda stories and advice me, please, whom I can trust. These are called preparation for war, done by few m******er masterminds. They are brainwashing guys outta there in the states. (as they did about WMD, Iraq, Bin Laden etc. fairy tales) Their only and just intention is to detract Iran's image among world public. To gain support to fight against another stable country in Middle East. (Iraq, Iran, and soon third one is probably gonna be Syria) They are danger to Israel!!!

As on topic, I do acknowledge Ahmadinajed acted foolish. By saying these kind of message he will encourage world politicians to keep away from him, not to integrate or co-operate with Iran, if not with Muslim people. He is not a smart man, IMO, he was a member of a bunch of hooligans, who brought the undemocratic system in power. (Revolution of 1979) IMO

There's a discourse theory in International relations, label someone in order that others will dislike them. Mujahedeens of Afganistan became terrorist when USA lost it's interests in that region..so...you have no right to repeat Satan's (USA) statement that they were hooligans...or did you take a part there...

Do you think a man who's opposing USA openly but not from web sites like others is a foolish....just think if the moslem world oppose in an united front there will be great achievement...what the bullshit you are talking about undemocratic system...raping women, stealing country's wealth,najis around,no criminal trial for americans in the soil of Iran for any crime before 1979...do you think this is democracy...REMEMBER....democracy is like "we want to do everything what we want"...this is the democracy....and this is what they are doing in other so called democratic countries...look what's happening in Saudia Arabia now...if you can analyse of course...

Sura-3 Семейство ‘Имрана
73. И нe вepyйтe никoмy, кpoмe тoгo, ктo пocлeдoвaл зa вaшeй peлигиeй". Cкaжи: "Пoиcтинe, пpямoe pyкoвoдcтвo - pyкoвoдcтвo Aллaxa - в тoм, чтo дaeтcя кoмy-нибyдь тaкoe жe, кaк былo дaнo вaм". Или oни cтaнyт пpeпиpaтьcя c вaми пpeд вaшим Гocпoдoм? Cкaжи: "Пoиcтинe, милocть - в pyкe Aллaxa: Oн дapyeт ee тeм, кoмy пoжeлaeт!" Пoиcтинe, Aллax Объeмлющ, Знaющ!

var

10-27-2005, 09:08 AM

Многие уже грозили. Ну и где эти "угрожатели", и где Израиль?

uki

10-27-2005, 09:09 AM

povedenie iranskogo prezidente eshe raz dokazivaet to chto on ne xorosho ponimaet v politike...

V otlichie ot nego Israel delaet eto v dele, a ne pustoslovnimi vikrikivaniyami...

Amiri Turkiston

10-27-2005, 09:16 AM

i takoy sverh umniy politik vstupaet v Shanhayskuyu Organizaciyu

damned

Guardian

10-27-2005, 11:03 AM

There's a discourse theory in International relations, label someone in order that others will dislike them. Mujahedeens of Afganistan became terrorist when USA lost it's interests in that region..so...you have no right to repeat Satan's (USA) statement that they were hooligans...or did you take a part there...

tarafdor,

All you said are just bias and emotion mixed views to me. This kind of reply furthers our discussion nowhere. please, refrain from turning to personal level. What I wrote above were my personal views and I have every RIGHT to express them, even if it doesn't match particularly with yours. As you read i clearly marked "IMO" when i said "a hooligan".

You can't argue with "..they are not hooligans ... or did you take part there" like naive arguments. Then it means you don't know too, ... or did you take part in there yourself? No?

Do you think a man who's opposing USA openly but not from web sites like others is a foolish....just think if the moslem world oppose in an united front there will be great achievement...
It means you don't know enough about modern politics or diplomacy. It is not an arena with gladiators, who have to fight physically in order to survive. Once you are leader you have to put your fantasies aside and use your brain, work strategically. Look, already Canada, Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Sweden, Australia, etc. have urged Iranian officials to apologise publicly, or even they are discussing to suspend Iranian membership in UNO. Iran's f**ed up now. From now on, I bet most of the world class politicians or officials will hesitate to shake hands with Ahmadenejad. He has isolated himself from world community, that imposes a threat to whole Iran of being sanctioned worldwide. You like that?

As about my "IMHO" (his hooliganism) I'd like to back-up it with some articles.

1. Alleged involvement in the 1979 Hostage Crisis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Alleged_involvement_in_the_197 9_Hostage_Crisis)
2. The Iran Focus photograph controversy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#The_Iran_Focus_photograph_cont roversy)
3. Kurdish-Austria Accusations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Kurdish-Austria_Accusations)
4. Political Dissent (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Political_Dissent)
5. Call for the Destruction of Israel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Call_for_the_Destruction_of_Is rael)...what the bullshit you are talking about undemocratic system...raping women, stealing country's wealth,najis around,no criminal trial for americans in the soil of Iran for any crime before 1979...do you think this is democracy...REMEMBER....democracy is like "we want to do everything what we want"...this is the democracy....and this is what they are doing in other so called democratic countries...look what's happening in Saudia Arabia now...if you can analyse of course...

Firstly, this statement of yours doesn't make sense at all. It's like "blah-blah-blah" ... sorry.

Secondly, can you elaborate on ".. bullshit .." part of my comments precisely, and prove I was wrong on that. I simply said it is undemocratic system in Iran, and I believe every 9 out of 10 will agree with it if they aren't pan-iranists.

FYI:

Post revolution impact in Iran:

However, despite a fair degree of democracy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy) in the post-revolutionary political structure (see politics of Iran (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Iran) for more depth), the violations of human rights (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights) during the theocratic regime have been of a similar level of brutality as during the monarchy. Torture (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torture), the imprisoning of dissidents, and the murder of prominent critics is commonplace. The oppression of women has been common since the revolution. So has the oppression of religious minorities, particularly the members of the Bahб'н Faith (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bah%C3%A1%27%C3%AD_Faith), which has been declared heretical. More than 200 Bahб'нs have been executed or killed, hundreds more have been imprisoned, and tens of thousands have been deprived of jobs, pensions, businesses, and educational opportunities. All national Bahб'н administrative structures have been banned by the government, and holy places, shrines and cemeteries have been confiscated, vandalized, or destroyed.
The revolution also left Iran isolated internationally, outcast from both the capitalist and communist worlds, with significant trade sanctions that continue to this day (by the United States (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States)).
On the other hand, the revolution also had the impact of allowing internal evolution of the political system, rather than evolution imposed by external pressures. For example, in 1997 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1997), reformist president Mohammad Khatami (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Khatami) was elected, and the relatively high level (for the region) of Internet penetration (as of 2004 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/As_of_2004), Iran had about 5 million internet users — [1] (http://www.internetworldstats.com/middle.htm), see also Iranian blogs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_blogs)) makes it difficult to stop this continued internal evolution of political thought and organisation.

Do you call it democratic?
Sura-3 Семейство ‘Имрана
73. И нe вepyйтe никoмy, кpoмe тoгo, ктo пocлeдoвaл зa вaшeй peлигиeй". Cкaжи: "Пoиcтинe, пpямoe pyкoвoдcтвo - pyкoвoдcтвo Aллaxa - в тoм, чтo дaeтcя кoмy-нибyдь тaкoe жe, кaк былo дaнo вaм". Или oни cтaнyт пpeпиpaтьcя c вaми пpeд вaшим Гocпoдoм? Cкaжи: "Пoиcтинe, милocть - в pyкe Aллaxa: Oн дapyeт ee тeм, кoмy пoжeлaeт!" Пoиcтинe, Aллax Объeмлющ, Знaющ!
Hope you follow it yourself too. It is odd enough to see person's quoting holy Qur'an after the "holy" manners and words he'd uttered.

Thanks.

stanford

10-27-2005, 11:29 AM

Zamon

10-27-2005, 11:54 AM

New Iranian President populist politician. I guess i made such stupid and cheap statement to gain more support among his own citizens. Pay attantion that right now Holy Month Ramadan. Iran dont have much friends in World. Only two powers support Iran, its Russia and China. If that guy will keep talking like that he might loss any kind of support.

UzLand

10-27-2005, 12:15 PM

One day Islamic republic of Iran is posing itself as the furious Jew-hater and protector of Palestinian state and the next day cooperating with Armenia and Russia to marginalize independent Azerbaijan...When Karabakh violence erupted Iran was on the Armenian side.

Great point. It is ok for Iran to be against Jews, but not ok to be against Christians. Would you say it is a hypocricy?

UzLand

10-27-2005, 12:16 PM

Pay attantion that right now Holy Month Ramadan.

You don't make such stupid statements especially in Ramadan. Especially being a prezident, not some kind of a second-tier politician.

UzLand

10-27-2005, 12:18 PM

povedenie iranskogo prezidente eshe raz dokazivaet to chto on ne xorosho ponimaet v politike...

V otlichie ot nego Israel delaet eto v dele, a ne pustoslovnimi vikrikivaniyami...

Ахмадинежод это иранский Жириновский:)

Martingale

10-27-2005, 12:27 PM

Ахмадинежод это иранский Жириновский:)

I was amazed by his interview given to Time when he was on trip to US. He was blaming US for international dominancy and unnessesary war on IRAQ(which I concur with). This guy is crazy, but seems to be rich!:cool:

fgerfr

10-27-2005, 02:17 PM

Вот, информация на русском языке. Я, вообще-то, не сторонник идеи о мировом сионистском заговоре, но я догадываюсь о том, что израильтяне, наверняка, страшно возмущены этими речами президента Ирана. Обратите внимание, на заголовок статьи. Чтобы успокоить наших израильских друзей, предлагаю переиначить её на следующий манер, как не "Мир без сионизма", а "Сионизм без мира". Думаю, израильтяне будут довольны. Чем больше уделяешь внимания, так называемым, сионистам, если они, вообще, реально существуют и имеют силу, тем они более будут чувствовать себя ответственными за судьбу "невежественного" мира. Так что, на самом деле, глава Ирана оказал великую услугу этим самым загадочным сионистам. Возможно, они не стоят того.

"Мир без сионизма". Президент Ирана разоблачает козни США и израильского режима
16:56 27.10.2005

http://www.irna.ir/

Ахмадинежад: Каждый, кто официально признает Израиль, будет гореть в огне исламского гнева
Тегеран, ИРНА. 27 октября 2005 года

"Если кто-то под давлением режима мировой тирании или же по бестолковости, эгоизму и алчности официально признает израильский режим, этот человек будет гореть в огне исламского гнева", - заявил Президент Ирана.

Как сообщил корреспондент ИРНА, в среду Ахмадинежад выступил на заседании "Мир без сионизма", которое состоялось в зале собраний Министерства внутренних дел ИРИ в Тегеране в преддверии Всемирного дня "Аль-Кудс" - солидарности с палестинским народом в борьбе с сионистами, – традиционно отмечаемого в Иране в последнюю пятницу месяца Рамадан.

>В ходе выступления президент предупредил исламский мир в отношении новой провокации мировой деспотии и заявил: "Каждый, кто официально признает существование узурпаторского сионистского режима, тот фактически подпишется под капитуляцией и поражением исламского мира".

"Нет никаких сомнений, - пояснил Ахмадинежад, выступая перед тысячами собравшихся учащихся тегеранских школ, - что новая волна борьбы, которая возникла в Палестине, и волна духовности и пробуждения в исламском мире вскоре сотрут это пятно позора (Израиль) с поверхности исламского мира".

"Мы должны быть бдительными в отношении провокаций режима мирового господства и тирании, поскольку вот уже более 50 лет главы мировой деспотии различными провокациями и давлением на исламские страны пытаются навязать мусульманам официальное признание фальшивого израильского режима", - заявил он.

По словам Ахмадинежада, освобождение и уход израильского режима из сектора Газа как части территории Палестины является новой хитростью сионистов, целью которой является признание Израиля исламскими странами.

Президент указал на козни США и израильского режима, направленные на внесение раздора в среду борющихся групп (Палестины) и исламского мира, и добавил: "Они стремятся стравить борющиеся палестинские группы и добиться путем формирования палестинского правительства признания некоторыми исламскими странами порочного израильского режима".

"Надеюсь, - заявил Президент ИРИ, - палестинский народ и палестинские борцы будут проявлять бдительность в отношении происков врага".

stanford

10-27-2005, 05:16 PM

Anyone who read that statement can tell that Iran's government is not peace loving.

PainKiller

10-27-2005, 05:19 PM

Whoever thinks that Israel can be destroyed should understand that their ass will be kicked after any attempt of this sort. THE WORLD is watching, and This is a good excuse to start another Irak.

Guardian

10-27-2005, 05:22 PM

Anyone who read that statement can tell that Iran's government is not peace loving.
what would happen on earth if you woke up tomorrow in the morning and saw all the "muslim country" leaders swapped their religion to Christianity and all christian leaders (i.e. Bush and Blair) into Islam?

what would Ahmadenejad's statement look like then?

(sorry if it is an of-topic question)

PainKiller

10-27-2005, 05:25 PM

Iraninan president should think, that his country is already a target for the next war, why would he say those words? Israel is not only Sharon it is also thousands of Israeli peace loving Jews.

Guardian

10-27-2005, 05:32 PM

stanford

10-27-2005, 05:39 PM

Guardian My point has nothing to do with what he will think if he changes his religion.

stanford

10-27-2005, 05:47 PM

stanford, it is not about whole Iran, what Ahmadnejad said, it is about ONE GUY only. Like, Bush used to stimulate his "lovely redneck republicans" to support to go to war against Iraq.

another thing is, i would truly suspect, Ahmadnejad is either a real hardcore kamikaze or CIA's ultra-undercover missioner.

Imagine the head of a western country making a statement that another country should be wiped off the map, in the face of the international community, that is what bothers me about Iran.

stanford

10-27-2005, 06:36 PM

I found this interesting

Russians help Iran with missile threat to Europe

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/10/16/wiran16.xml&sSheet=/news/2005/10/16/ixnewstop.html

stanford

10-27-2005, 07:04 PM

more

Arab States Silent on Iran's Remarks

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2005/10/27/international/i145241D70.DTL&hw=Arab+States&sn=001&sc=1000

Blair Rebukes Iran for Threats against Israel

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/foreignaffairs/story/0,11538,1602510,00.html (http://politics.guardian.co.uk/foreignaffairs/story/0,11538,1602510,00.html)

UzLand

10-27-2005, 08:51 PM

Iraninan president should think, that his country is already a target for the next war, why would he say those words? Israel is not only Sharon it is also thousands of Israeli peace loving Jews.

Вот именно. Зачем давать лишний повод и ускорять войну? Надо наоборот быть хитрым и не давать повода. Если повода не будет, то Европа Иран в обиду не даст. И потом США сейчас не в том положении, чтобы развязывать еще одну войну, но вариант с нападением самого Израиля наиболее вероятен, тем более что Устав ООН (Статья 7) дает им и Совбезу полное право наказать плохиша.

UzLand

10-27-2005, 08:56 PM

Arab States Silent on Iran's Remarks

Арабы тут играет в свою игру. Им лучше молчать, потому что в этом случае Иран будет отдуваться за всех, а с другой стороны они не прочь, чтобы дали Ирану по заднице. Не любят они друг друга.

The Reaper

10-27-2005, 09:28 PM

Whiners whiners.....

If only they worked and studied more, instead of blaming Israel, Jews, USA, Satan, etc. They are lazy, stupid, and most importantly naive.

TR

Prince

10-27-2005, 09:29 PM

Iran is the only muslim contry who can play "aganist" US ,
Who else? Pakistan? Mr Musharraf is good friend of Mr Bush!?

Prince

10-27-2005, 09:36 PM

Ya odno ne poymu Nu i chto esli on skazal eto?
Pochemu President Ameriki kogdato govoril chto on nachinaet voynu protiv Iraka ili Afganistana - i vse na eto smotreli normalno , a seychas kogda glava Irana govorit - pochti odno i toje vse "figeyut" ?

krokobazuka

10-27-2005, 09:46 PM

Арабы балбесы и тупицы...

С их энергоресурсами давно можно было надавить на США и Европу и добится конца оккупации...

Израиль имеет право на существование, но в рамках своей границы. Это уже 21 век и пора вперед двигаться...

А на счет арабов - думаю что более идиотских способов тратить деньги от дара Божьего для их нации - нефти, чем они это делают нет.

Вместо инвестиций направленных на усиление стран и помощи мусульманскому миру, эти тупицы тратят на женщин (проституцию), золотые унитазы и искуственные острова.. Благодаря таким умникам, мусульманский мир еще долго будет отсталым...

PS Don't even try to point at my religious belief..

Amiri Turkiston

10-27-2005, 10:54 PM

takim pravitelyam nelza doveryat kreslo i stranu

vet starshiy brat Israilya yavlaetsya USA

a amerikosi tak i tak kosa smotryat na Iran, i pitayutsya nayti otmazku chtob nachat eshe odnu voynu protiv terrora

hotya budget amerikosov ne smojet perenesti esho odnu voynu

vet za kajdiy chas voyni v Iraki - oni tratyat esli ne oshibayus USD 10 000 000

prekinte kakaya eto summa

ДЖИГИТ

10-27-2005, 11:00 PM

Talk By: Rabbi Ahron Cohen at Birmingham University, England
26th February ‘03

My friends, it is an honour to have the opportunity of talking to you today.

I and my colleagues of Neturei Karta attend occasions such as this because we feel that we have both a religious and humanitarian duty to publicize our message as much as possible. So I hope and pray that with the Creator’s help my words and our discussions here today may be correct and true in their content and conclusions.

As you have already been told, I am an orthodox Jew (that is a Jew who endeavours to live his life completely in accordance with the Jewish religion). I am involved in ecclesiastical duties within the Jewish Community and am particularly involved in educating our youth and in helping them to achieve healthy and correct attitudes. It is therefore of particular interest to me to be able to talk to you, a student body, today.
I have been asked to talk to you about Judaism and Zionism. This subject is of course tremendously relevant in the light of the current situation in Palestine, where you have - let’s face it - one side, the Zionists (who are also Jews), wishing to impose a ‘sectarian’ State over the heads of an indigenous population, the Palestinians. A confrontation which has resulted in horrific bloodshed and brutality with no end in sight unless there is a very radical change.

My qualification to talk on this subject is by virtue of my being one of many orthodox Jews who absolutely sympathise with the Palestinian cause, and we protest vehemently against the terrible wrongs being perpetrated against the Palestinian People by the Zionist illegitimate regime in Palestine.

The spearhead group among us who are involved actively in this matter on a regular basis are called Neturei Karta, which can be loosely translated as Guardians of the Faith. We are not a separate party or organisation but basically a philosophy representative of a large section of orthodox Jewry.
Let me firstly state quite categorically that Judaism and Zionism are incompatible. They are diametrically opposed.

The question must surely arise in the minds of many of you here today that there appears to be a paradox. After all everyone knows that Zionists are Jews and that Zionism is for the benefit of Jews. The Palestinians are the enemies of the Zionists. How come then that I, a Jew, can sympathise with the Palestinian cause.

I would like to try to answer this question and to revert to the subject of my talk - Judaism and Zionism - on two levels, religious belief and humanitarianism. Bearing in mind that to be humanitarian is also a basic religious requirement.

Firstly from a Jewish religious belief point of view. One has to take a look at some aspects of the history of the Jewish people and at their basic belief in the Al-mighty’s control of our destiny and what the Al-mighty wants of us. All as set out in our Religious teachings, our Toira, and as taught to us through the generations by our great religious leaders. Against this we also have to look at the history of Zionism, how it developed, what are its aims.

Our religion is for us a total way of life. Showing us how to live a life in the service of the Al-mighty. It affects every aspect of our life from the cradle to the grave. We are taught that it was revealed to us by Divine Revelation, as described in the Bible, some three and a half thousand years ago, and that is when the Jewish People came in to being. All of our religious requirements, practical and philosophical, are set out in the Torah which comprises the Bible (the old testament) and a vast code of Oral Teaching handed down to us through the generations.

As mentioned, our religion is a total way of life covering every aspect of our life. One area of our religion is that subject to certain conditions is that we will be given a land, the Holy Land, now known as Palestine, in which to live and carry out various parts of our service of the Al-mighty.

http://www.nkusa.org/activities/speeches/bham022603.cfm

MUHLIS

10-27-2005, 11:00 PM

Guys hating Jews does not make someone or some country automatically a good "muslim". Hitler, who killed millions of Jews was not "muslim" and I do not think Muslim unity should be elaborated on anti-semitism.
There are a lot of similarities between Hitler's Germany and current mainstream iranian politics be it shia mullahs or secular "aryans". Both Hitler and Iranian shah measured human skulps to prove superiority of the "aryan" race and both of them hate Jews. It is probably they are jealious.
Iranian leader's statement is not because of his stupitidy, it simply shows how high their ambitions are. By this statement and positioning itself more closer to China and Russia Iran is trying tickle the nerves of Russia and China hoping this would speed up the prosess of possible conflict between US and the other two and by showing off as a devote protector of Plestinian state iranian leader is hoping to get support from the Arab world. Therefore, Arabs have their own reasons for being silent.

ДЖИГИТ

10-27-2005, 11:01 PM

Now, before I go any further, I wish to point out something which is very basic to understanding the difference between Judaism and Zionism and that is that the orthodox Jewish concept of nationhood is very different to the concept of nationhood held by most peoples. Most peoples understand a nation to be a specific people living in a specific land. The land is essential for the identity of the nation. They may or may not have a religion, but the religion is immaterial to the national identity. The orthodox Jewish concept of nationhood however, is a specific people with a specific religion. It is the religion that establishes the national identity. They may or may not have a land, the land is immaterial to the Jewish national identity.

This is borne out by the fact that the Jewish nation has been without a land for 2000 years, but as long as they retained their religion they retained their identity.

Now I mentioned earlier that we were given a land but under certain conditions. The conditions were basically that we had to maintain the highest of moral, ethical and religious standards. The Jewish People did have the land for approximately the first one thousand five hundred years of their existence. However, regretfully, the conditions were not fulfilled to the required degree and the Jews were exiled from their land. For the last two thousand years or so the Jewish people have been in a state of exile decreed by the A-lmighty because they did not maintain the standards expected of them. This state of exile is the situation that exists right up to the present day. It is a basic part of our belief to accept willingly the Heavenly decree of exile and not to try and fight against it or to end it by our own hands. To do so would constitute a rebellion against the wishes of the A-lmighty.

In practical terms, although we have maintained our Jewish identity by virtue of our attachment to our religion, never the less exile for us means firstly that Jews must be loyal subjects of the countries in which they live and not attempt to rule over the established indigenous populations of those countries.

Secondly, that we may not attempt to set up a State of our own in Palestine.

This would apply even if the land would be unoccupied and it certainly applies when, as is the case, there is an existing indigenous population. This prohibition is a basic part of our teaching and we are forsworn not to contravene it and we are warned of the dire consequences of doing so.
It follows, therefore, that Jews have no right to rule today in Palestine.
Now let us consider the Zionist movement. This was founded approximately 100 years ago mostly by secular people who were discarding their religion but still retained what they considered as the stigma of being Jews in exile. They considered that our state of exile was due to our own subservient attitude - ‘the Golus (exile) mentality’ - and not by Divine Decree. They wanted to throw off the constraints of exile and to try and establish a new form of Jewish identity. Not religion based but land based. It was based on a typical, emotion driven, secular nationalistic aim, similar to that of most other nations. Their policy had as its centre pin the aim of setting up a Jewish State in Palestine. But they were forging a new kind of Jew. In fact not a Jew at all- a Zionist.

This Zionist movement was a complete abandonment of our religious teachings and faith - in general - and in particular an abandonment of our approach to our state of exile and our attitude to the peoples among whom we live.

The practical outcome of Zionism in the form of the State known as ‘Israel’ is completely alien to Judaism and the Jewish Faith. The very name “Israel” which originally meant what are known as the Children of Israel i.e. the Jewish People was usurped by the Zionists. For this reason many orthodox Jews avoid referring to the Zionist State by the name ’Israel’.
The ideology of Zionism is not to rely on divine providence but to take the law into ones own hands and to try to force the outcome in the form of a State. This is completely contrary to the approach to the matter of exile which our Toira requires us to adopt, as handed down to us by our great religious teachers.

ДЖИГИТ

10-27-2005, 11:03 PM

I have spoken till now from the religious belief point of view. But let us consider the humanitarian point of view (and to do so is also a religious requirement as I mentioned earlier).The Zionist ideology was and is to force the aim of a State irrespective of the cost in life and property to anyone who stands in the way. The Palestinians stood in the way. We have a fact that in order to achieve an ill conceived nationalistic ambition, a shocking contravention of natural justice was committed by the Zionists in setting up an illegitimate regime in Palestine completely against the wishes of the established population, the Palestinians, which inevitably had to be based on loss of life, killing and stealing.

Most Orthodox Jews accept the Neturei Karta view to the extent that they do not agree in principle to the existence of the Zionist State and would not ‘shed a tear‘ if it came to an end. There are however a range of opinions as to how to deal with the fact that for the time being the Zionist State exists. These opinions range from positive cooperation to pragmatic acceptance to total opposition in every way. The latter being the Neturei Karta approach.

There was and is however, an additional Zionist phenomenon which confuses the picture. That is the Religious Zionists. These are people who claim to be faithful to the Jewish Religion but they have been influenced by the Zionist secular nationalistic philosophy and have added a new dimension to Judaism - Zionism, the aim of setting up now and expanding a Jewish state in Palestine. This they try to fulfil with great fervour. (I call it Judaism-plus) They claim that this is inherent in the Jewish religion. But the fact is as explained earlier that this is absolutely contrary to the teachings of our great religious teachers.

Furthermore, from a humanitarian point of view, their ideology too was and is to force their aim irrespective of the cost in life and property to anyone who stands in the way. The Palestinians are standing in the way. This is all the more shocking as it is done in the name of religion. Whereas in reality there is a totally contrary requirement of our religion and that is to treat all peoples with compassion.

To sum up. According to the Torah and Jewish faith, the present Palestinian > Arab claim to rule in Palestine is right and just. The Zionist claim is wrong and criminal. Our attitude to Israel is that the whole concept is flawed and illegitimate.

We have another problem and that is that the Zionists have made themselves to appear as the representatives and spokespeople of all Jews thus, with their actions, arousing animosity against the Jews. Those who harbour this animosity are accused of anti-Semitism. However, what has to be made abundantly clear is that Zionism is not Judaism. Zionists cannot speak in the name of Jews. Zionists may have been born as Jews, but to be a Jew also requires adherence to the Jewish belief and religion. So what becomes abundantly clear is that opposition to Zionism and its crimes does not imply hatred of Jews or ‘anti-Semitism‘. On the contrary Zionism itself and its deeds are the biggest threat to Jews and Judaism.
The strife between Arab and Jew in Palestine only began when the first Zionist pioneers came to Palestine with the express aim of forming a State over the heads of the indigenous Arab population. That strife has continued until this very day and has cost and continues to cost thousands and thousands of lives. The oppression, abuse and murder in Palestine is a tragedy not only for the Palestinians but for the Jewish people as well. And is in fact part of the dire consequences of which we are warned if we transgress our religious requirement not to rebel against our exile.

I wish to add that the connection between Muslims and Jews goes right back into ancient history. Mostly the relationship was friendly and mutually beneficial. Historically, the situation frequently was that when Jews were being persecuted in Europe they found refuge in the various Muslim countries. Our attitude to Muslims and Arabs can only be one of friendliness and respect.

I would like to finish with the following words. We want to tell the world, especially our Muslim neighbours, that there is no hatred or animosity between Jew and Muslim. We wish to live together as friends and neighbours as we have done mostly over hundreds even thousands of years in all the Arab countries. It was only the advent of the Zionists and Zionism which upset this age old relationship.
We consider the Palestinians as the people with the right to govern in Palestine.

The Zionist State known as ”Israel” is a regime that has no right to exist. Its continuing existence is the underlying cause of the strife in Palestine. 33. We pray for a solution to the terrible and tragic impasse that exists. Hopefully based on results brought about by moral, political and economic pressures imposed by the nations of the world.

We pray for an end to bloodshed and an end to the suffering of all innocent people - Jew and non-Jew alike - worldwide.
We are waiting for the annulment of Zionism and the dismantling of the Zionist regime, which will bring about an end to the suffering of the Palestinian people. We would welcome the opportunity to dwell in peace in the holy land under a rule which is entirely in accordance with the wishes and aspirations of the Palestinian People.

May we soon merit the time when all mankind will be at peace with each other.

Orthodox Jewry.

Oriyon_farr

10-28-2005, 12:11 AM

Может быть не правильно перевели слова Ахмединежада. Он же в основном о Сионизме говорил.

PainKiller

10-28-2005, 12:13 AM

ДЖИГИТ

10-28-2005, 12:51 AM

DJIGIT, I AM MORE THAN SURE THAT THIS RABBI HAS NEVER SAID ANY OF THESE WORDS, OTHERWISE YOU WOULD NOT REDIRET US INTO THE WEBSITE WHICH IS CALLED "ISRAEL, JUDAISM, ZIONISM.
Let me explain you my position, how come such a brilliant speech or this Jew was not published in any Jewish or Israel based websites?:D

Kleo or Inko, do you watch for such news or read and listen Jewish media? or at least visit orthodox jewish websites? If not then how do you know they don't publish in Jewish media? It's evident orthodox jews are ousted from Israel and they would not wish to live under Zionists rule, so is their advocacy is limited by Zionists. By the way the all known movie Matrix is directed on the Zionists ideology that even we can hear words like Zion in part 2.

learn about Jewish activism against Zionism:

www.nkusa.org (http://www.nkusa.org)

www.jewsagainstzionism.com (http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com)

www.netureikarta.org (http://www.netureikarta.org)

www.jewsnotzionists.org (http://www.jewsnotzionists.org)

www.netureikartauk.org (http://www.netureikartauk.org)

Black

10-28-2005, 01:17 AM

When people will stop posting moronic ideas like yours.On my lunch break,I will go to the garbage can and turn out as a disrespect because of stupid posts you've recently made.I explained Iran's position in previous thread, if you didn't lose your mind go back and read.

What kind of statement head of the state have made if it has peaceful intentions? Don't you think that kind of statement will inspire Palestinians to blow themselves up. Like all the terrorist masterminds, it's easier to send some kid to blow himself up than for them to be moderate and attempt a diplomatic solution. Aren't you become one of them??

As a head of the country,for sake of his own people he should be more interested in staying alive and keeping his country in one piece rather than making an unprovoked attack against Israel. If the head of the country makes a statement as political endorsement for suicide bombings,invoking Islamic insecurity around the region,what else do you need ? How much more factor does it need to be? If you do not consider any of those informations given,whom do you consider as reliable? How reliable you are to check the reliability of the sources given online? I see you do not accept any sourse except of those who are mujahids of ideas leading to Nor.

If the statement above is yours than it explains to me that you lack of understanding the whole point I meant.I would like to hear what international packs,treaties have in their mind after such kind of statement from the head of the government.
1) Can you show me what my moronic ideas are.
2) My point is, how peacefull (or warfull) mind Iranian president is, Iran has a right to enrich uranium.
3) You did not answer my questions in my previuos post. Do not try to "aravani quruq op qochish". The issue here has nothing to do Iran's intention to produce nuclear energy.
4) You want to know what international treaties allow Iran to produce nuclear energy. Search and you'll find.
5) About sources. You can bring any source, but none of them say that Iran is going to attack Israel. Reread the news, then reread it again and ask somebody to explain you.
6) You also, if did not lost your mind, go back and reread my posts in previous thread.
7) It is not your business what kind of statement a head of the state makes, at least he does not ask you advice. You are not in position to point out what head of state can and should do. You think that you a world class politician. I open you are secret: you are not! You are just a guy who was fed up with cheap american junk news.
8) Last, but not the least, you spend so much effort to criticise Iranian policy, which did not attack and invade any other country and shut you big mouth up about American policy, which invade any other country which it does not like without any reason, regardless of UN protest? Double standards? Is it called hypocrisy? It is! So stop acting as peace-loving american redneck.
Either the same standards for everybody, or just stop accusing others.

Peace.

Black

10-28-2005, 01:28 AM

MUHLIS

10-28-2005, 01:38 AM

Stanford, Black, Iran, Israel...& uranium, nuclear energy....that happened before. I need to put my comment again.
I think nobody will refuse if I say both Iran (or Suria) and Israel will miss no opportunity to launch a nuclear attack on each other. In other words, the propability of Iranian nuclar attack to Israil is equal to Israel's nuclear attack to Iran.
Keeping that in mind,
1. Why EU & US think Iran cannot enrich uranium (actually for peaceful purposes)?
2. Why EU & US is silent about Israel's (not-so-peaceful) nuclear programs and instead provide extensive help?

WHY??? Why Israel can have nuclear reactors and Iran cannot?

PainKiller

10-28-2005, 02:31 AM

Iran is the only muslim contry who can play "aganist" US ,
Who else? Pakistan? Mr Musharraf is good friend of Mr Bush!?Well, I do not like when people play with words like some people do. You people Say Iranians are shias, and as they say shirk like "La ilaha illallah, Mohammadin Rasulullah, Ali Wali Allah" instead of the right way Ahli Sunna wa Jamaa does. I met a lot of people who say Shias are not muslims, but when they talk about possible war against Iran, they Yell Iranians are muslims and other muslims should support them. And at this point I would Like to ask Prince, Do u think that Shias are Muslims? If yes, Does it mean that u accept the way Shias say Kalima Shahada as a right way, or do u think that u still can be a muslim even if Your aqeeda contradicts the teachings of Rasululloh?
Sorry, this has nothing to do with Iranian presidents Speech. It just crossed my mind When I was reading Prince's post.

And now back to the subj.
I truly believe, that when it comes to Presidents, To religious leaders, they should undersrand that what they say will touch somehow those whom they represent. I mean, Iranian president, Should be politically correct when using words and expressions. Saying "Israel should be wipped off the Map" is very, very wrong, and definetely World will remind Iran those words innear future. I did not say that States will start War on Iran in near Future. Plus, Bush is for another 4 years, a lot can happen, but I doubt two wars at the same time in Iraq and Iran. But USA can push countries to enforce Veto and economical sanctions or other sort of punishments against Iran.

This was a very, very wrong thing to say by him.

Oriyon_farr

10-28-2005, 03:04 AM

Лидер американских евреев: преступления сионистов - позор для всех евреев

Лидер антисионистской общины евреев США заявил, что преступления сионистского режима на оккупированных территориях Палестины подорвали авторитет евреев и стали предметом позора для них. Раввин Давид Вайс заявил нашему корреспонденту в Нью-Йорке: «Мы, антисионистские евреи, в одном ряду с палестинцами и другими мусульманами мира во всемирный день Кодса (в последнюю пятницу месяца Рамадана) выразим свое гневное возмущение в отношении мирового сионизма». Указав на то, что сионисты стараются при помощи отрицательной пропаганды создать видимость того, что день Кодса – это день борьбы с еврейской религией, раввин Давид Вайс отметил, что до появления сионизма мусульмане и евреи жили в мире, и примеры такого сосуществования наблюдаются сегодня в Иране, но сионисты подорвали облик еврейской религии. Лидер антисионистской общины евреев в США заявил, в частности, что сегодня преступления сионистского режима против палестинцев носят настолько откровенный характер, что бдительные народы мира осознали, что к сожалению европейские и американские СМИ и государства, поддерживают Израиль, предотвращая разоблачение его варварской сущности.
Сославшись на влияние сионистов в правящих кругах США, Вайс добавил, что на выборах в США побеждают только кандидаты, пользующиеся поддержкой сионистов.
В завершении раввин Вайс выразил надежду, что участие миллионов мусульман в акциях протеста Всемирного дня Кодса окажется эффективным в восстановлении прав многострадального палестинского народа.

http://www.irib.ir/worldservice/russianradio/HTML/Crida.htm/13.htm

Oriyon_farr

10-28-2005, 03:20 AM

А вот как перевели слова Ахмединежада журналисты иранского информагентства IRNA:

Ахмадинежад: Каждый, кто официально признает Израиль, будет гореть в огне исламского гнева

«Если кто-то под давлением режима мировой тирании или же по бестолковости, эгоизму и алчности официально признает израильский режим, этот человек будет гореть в огне исламского гнева», - заявил Президент Ирана.
Как сообщил корреспондент ИРНА, в среду Ахмадинежад выступил на заседании «Мир без сионизма», которое состоялось в зале собраний Министерства внутренних дел ИРИ в Тегеране в преддверии Всемирного дня «Аль-Кудс» - солидарности с палестинским народом в борьбе с сионистами, – традиционно отмечаемого в Иране в последнюю пятницу месяца Рамадан.
В ходе выступления президент предупредил исламский мир в отношении новой провокации мировой деспотии и заявил: «Каждый, кто официально признает существование узурпаторского сионистского режима, тот фактически подпишется под капитуляцией и поражением исламского мира».
«Нет никаких сомнений, - пояснил Ахмадинежад, выступая перед тысячами собравшихся учащихся тегеранских школ, - что новая волна борьбы, которая возникла в Палестине, и волна духовности и пробуждения в исламском мире вскоре сотрут это пятно позора (Израиль) с поверхности исламского мира».
«Мы должны быть бдительными в отношении провокаций режима мирового господства и тирании, поскольку вот уже более 50 лет главы мировой деспотии различными провокациями и давлением на исламские страны пытаются навязать мусульманам официальное признание фальшивого израильского режима», - заявил он.
По словам Ахмадинежада, освобождение и уход израильского режима из сектора Газа как части территории Палестины является новой хитростью сионистов, целью которой является признание Израиля исламскими странами.
Президент указал на козни США и израильского режима, направленные на внесение раздора в среду борющихся групп (Палестины) и исламского мира, и добавил: «Они стремятся стравить борющиеся палестинские группы и добиться путем формирования палестинского правительства признания некоторыми исламскими странами порочного израильского режима».
«Надеюсь, - заявил Президент ИРИ, - палестинский народ и палестинские борцы будут проявлять бдительность в отношении происков врага».
---> Фото: выступление Махмуда Ахмадинежада

http://www.irna.ir/ru/news/view/line-55/0510271239132225.htm

Все таки есть разница между двумя вариантами перевода "Израиль должен быть стёрт с лица земли" и "волна духовности и пробуждения в исламском мире вскоре сотрут это пятно позора (Израиль) с поверхности исламского мира". В первом варианте перевода намёк делается на то, что именно Иран планирует разбомбить Израиль, а согласно второму варианту перевода, Ахмединежад скорее хотел сказать, что исламский мир скоро окончательно разберется с арабо-израилской проблемой.

PainKiller

10-28-2005, 03:33 AM

Все таки есть разница между двумя вариантами перевода "Израиль должен быть стёрт с лица земли" и "волна духовности и пробуждения в исламском мире вскоре сотрут это пятно позора (Израиль) с поверхности исламского мира". В первом варианте перевода намёк делается на то, что именно Иран планирует разбомбить Израиль, а согласно второму варианту перевода, Ахмединежад скорее хотел сказать, что исламский мир скоро окончательно разберется с арабо-израилской проблемой.net, On imenno hotel skazat' chto Sotrut s zemli Pozor aka Izrail'. Zachem je licemerit'?

var

10-28-2005, 03:38 AM

Израиль не сотрут с лица земли....по крайней мере в обозримом будущем. Это скорее всего просто политическое заявление для поднятия своего имиджа среди граждан Ирана...

PainKiller

10-28-2005, 04:36 AM

Израиль не сотрут с лица земли....по крайней мере в обозримом будущем. Это скорее всего просто политическое заявление для поднятия своего имиджа среди граждан Ирана...Nu vot primer, Vasya kakaet na kover kogda hodit v gosti. On govorit tak emu velyat Visshie kosmicheskie sili, a Po mne on prosto zasranec. :rolleyes: Motivaciya posle takogo uje malo kogo interesuet. Glavnoe chto on eto skazal i teper' uje pozdno.

ДЖИГИТ

10-28-2005, 04:58 AM

net, On imenno hotel skazat' chto Sotrut s zemli Pozor aka Izrail'. Zachem je licemerit'?

otkuda ti znaesh', chto on hotel skazat?

Kto bi govoril o litsemerii!

var

10-28-2005, 05:04 AM

Nu vot primer, Vasya kakaet na kover kogda hodit v gosti. On govorit tak emu velyat Visshie kosmicheskie sili, a Po mne on prosto zasranec. :rolleyes: Motivaciya posle takogo uje malo kogo interesuet. Glavnoe chto on eto skazal i teper' uje pozdno.
Согласен. Т.к. это глава страны а не кто - то иной.
Так что сравнение с Жириновским не совсем верно.

PainKiller

10-28-2005, 05:04 AM

otkuda ti znaesh', chto on hotel skazat?

Kto bi govoril o litsemerii!Slushay, Vasya, ili kak tebya zvat', ti Oriyon Farr? Esli net, to ne beri na sebya slishkom mnogo i ne meshay vesti besedu s interesnim chelovekom.

PainKiller

10-28-2005, 05:07 AM

Согласен. Т.к. это глава страны а не кто - то иной.
Так что сравнение с Жириновским не совсем верно.
геее, так его с Жириком сравнили? Жирик депутат, после того скандального выступления Официальная Моксва извинилась:
-Ой, Жирик-же долбик, не обижайтесь, мы сами офигели от такого заявления, давайте дружить-а?)))
А как быть в случае с Президентом?:lol:
Для особо одарённых, Официальный тегеран никоим образом не отреагировал на данную речь, почему?:twisted:

var

10-28-2005, 05:23 AM

геее, так его с Жириком сравнили? Жирик депутат, после того скандального выступления Официальная Моксва извинилась:
-Ой, Жирик-же долбик, не обижайтесь, мы сами офигели от такого заявления, давайте дружить-а?)))
А как быть в случае с Президентом?:lol:
Для особо одарённых, Официальный тегеран никоим образом не отреагировал на данную речь, почему?:twisted:
Потому что антисимитизм это их национальная идея :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

krokobazuka

10-28-2005, 10:29 AM

Krokobazuka, Iransi ne arabi, oni persidsi.
Ostalnoe, chastichno pravilno.

Nu eto yasniy den'... Prosto i u arabov i u persov mechta odna: unichtojit' Israel... Tol'ko eto u nih uje ne poluchitsya..

stanford

10-28-2005, 11:58 AM

1) Can you show me what my moronic ideas are..
Iranians are Iranians

Does it make any sense to anyone?
2) My point is, how peacefull (or warfull) mind Iranian president is, Iran has a right to enrich uranium.
I don't know,maybe the fact that I don't see this as being brainwashed is exactly what makes me brainwashed in your eyes....Ahhh the troubles with understanding.
3) You did not answer my questions in my previuos post. Do not try to "aravani quruq op qochish". The issue here has nothing to do Iran's intention to produce nuclear energy.

I don't see any reason to believe in your statements than I do for the one you are arguing against.I asked about reliable sources so we can learn better of , for future use.And in this next silly statement do you mean Iranian president has nothing to do with government affairs?
4) You want to know what international treaties allow Iran to produce nuclear energy. Search and you'll find
I want to know how they will allow, you coudn't bring one.Give me the link.
5) About sources. You can bring any source, but none of them say that Iran is going to attack Israel. Reread the news, then reread it again and ask somebody to explain you.

"Funny!! Iran is not going to attack Israel,It was just a stupid statement by narrow minded president ,and we will trust our president with "peaceful" thoughts on his mind.Or It will attack Israel,when somebody officially declares it,until,we just sit and wait.Looking for reliable sources from Black."
6) You also, if did not lost your mind, go back and reread my posts in previous thread.
I reread it and found your ignorance.
7) It is not your business what kind of statement a head of the state makes, at least he does not ask you advice. You are not in position to point out what head of state can and should do. You think that you a world class politician. I open you are secret: you are not! You are just a guy who was fed up with cheap american junk news.
It will be very helpful once again if you provide these forum members with real news and sources.We are tired of everyday junk news.

8) Last, but not the least, you spend so much effort to criticise Iranian policy, which did not attack and invade any other country and shut you big mouth up about American policy, which invade any other country which it does not like without any reason, regardless of UN protest? Double standards? Is it called hypocrisy? It is! So stop acting as peace-loving american redneck.
Either the same standards for everybody, or just stop accusing others.
Peace

Have you ever thought about doing something else than constantly posting your silly ideas?

Zamon

10-28-2005, 01:00 PM

ultimately Iran is going to get nuclear weapon. All that Irans main goal is not nuclear weapons but just energy is CRAP. everybody knows that. Every country have a right build Weapons as long as if its for own protection. USA not that county to say who can do and cannot get weapons. I agree with that, but after statement of Iranian President......just imagine that Iran already have some nuclear weapon. Where is gurantee that President Ahmedinejad will not use that weapon for "whipe out Israel from the Earth" ?? I mean he can say you know, if i will do i will be rock! coolest guy among muslims. what will hold Iranian president using weapons agains Israel? nothing! Before i could say "common sense" but now....he still kep saying that he is right! and He is officially elected President of Iran, one of the biggest state in middle east region, with huge population and strong military capabilties, and of course with great plans getting Nuclear weapons.

stanford

10-28-2005, 01:08 PM

Zamon, agree! We can not trust Iran with nuclear weapon.Why it's very hard for some people to understand.

krokobazuka

10-28-2005, 01:13 PM

Zamon, agree! We can not trust Iran with nuclear weapon.Why it's very hard for some people to understand.

Why can you trust Israel, Pakistan and India, but not Iran?

Who is decide whether certain country has a right to have nuclear weapons and who doesn't?

Remember, the only country to actually use nukes was the USA - the forepost of "democracy" (hypocracy)...

Zamon

10-28-2005, 01:21 PM

Why can you trust Israel, Pakistan and India, but not Iran?

Who is decide whether certain country has a right to have nuclear weapons and who doesn't?

Remember, the only country to actually use nukes was the USA - the forepost of "democracy" (hypocracy)...

I think nobody will decide! Its every countryies right protect own nation. Bu tso far Presidents of those states with Nuclear Arm did not say about destroying certain country from the earth. President Musharraf is Dictator but he is not stupid to attack India first or say something like Iranian President. India is biggest democratic nation in the world there is no doubt that India will attack first any country. There are consequences to think.

stanford

10-28-2005, 01:49 PM

Why can you trust Israel, Pakistan and India, but not Iran?

krokobazuka I hope you can find some answers in our privious discussion (http://www.forum.uz/showthread.php?t=19821&highlight=nuclear).

krokobazuka

10-28-2005, 01:59 PM

I think nobody will decide! Its every countryies right protect own nation. Bu tso far Presidents of those states with Nuclear Arm did not say about destroying certain country from the earth. President Musharraf is Dictator but he is not stupid to attack India first or say something like Iranian President. India is biggest democratic nation in the world there is no doubt that India will attack first any country. There are consequences to think.

If India is democratic country, why wouldn't it allow democratic referendum in Kashmir? The whole democracy thing is a BS - as I said, it's a good tool in pushing ideas of the dominant countries in their own interests..

I agree, Iranian president said stupid thing... Yet, the media attack in Iran is completely pathetic... Israel remains an occupant state.. It provokes conflict every time (recent killing of one of Islamic Jihad leaders again started the suicide bombings).. And media bias will never go away unless the rulers of "Islamic world" become little more far thinking and strategic

Besides, why do you think people can trust Israel? Does a name Baruch Goldstein ring a bell? Who has a guarantee that no Baruch Goldstein type people will govern Israel in the future?

Martingale

10-28-2005, 02:13 PM

UNSC discusses statement decrying Iran's anti-Israel comments

UNITED NATIONS, Oct. 28 (Xinhuanet) -- The UN Security Council is discussing a British-drafted presidential statement which would decry the Iranian president's radical comments on Israel, diplomats said Friday.
The two-paragraph statement, presented by British UN Ambassador Emyr Jones at an informal council meeting, says the council "strongly condemns" the remarks by Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, who called for Israel to be "wiped off the map."
In the statement, the 15-nation council would also express strong support for UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan's statement issued Thursday, which noted that, under the UN Charter, all UN members have undertaken to refrain from the threat or use of force against the territorial or political independence of any state.
Ahmadinejad's statement has drawn sharp criticism from the European Union, Israel and many other countries. At an anti-Zionism rally in Teheran Wednesday, Ahmadinejad said, "As the Imam (Iran's late revolutionary leader Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini) said, Israel must be wiped off the map."

source: http://regimechangeiran.com/

Martingale

10-28-2005, 02:26 PM

So, just for the record, here are some of the UN resolutions condemning Israel for its actions:

Resolution 106: condemns Israel for Gaza raid.

Resolution 111: condemns Israel for raid on Syria that killed fifty-six people.

Resolution 127: recommends Israel suspend its no-man's zone' in Jerusalem.

Resolution 162: urges Israel to comply with UN decisions.

Resolution 171: determines flagrant violations by Israel in its attack on Syria.

Resolution 228: censures Israel for its attack on Samu in the West Bank, then under Jordanian control.

Resolution 237: urges Israel to allow return of new 1967 Palestinian refugees.

Resolution 248: condemns Israel for its massive attack on Karameh in Jordan.

Resolution 250: calls on Israel to refrain from holding military parade in Jerusalem.

Resolution 251: deeply deplores Israeli military parade in Jerusalem in defiance of Resolution 250.

Resolution 252: declares invalid Israel's acts to unify Jerusalem as Jewish capital.

Resolution 256: condemns Israeli raids on Jordan as flagrant violation.

Resolution 259: deplores Israel's refusal to accept UN mission to probe occupation.

Resolution 262: condemns Israel for attack on Beirut airport.

Resolution 265: condemns Israel for air attacks for Salt in Jordan.

Resolution 267: censures Israel for administrative acts to change the status of Jerusalem.

Resolution 270: condemns Israel for air attacks on villages in southern Lebanon.

Resolution 271: condemns Israel's failure to obey UN resolutions on Jerusalem.

Resolution 279: demands withdrawal of Israeli forces from Lebanon.

Resolution 280: condemns Israeli's attacks against Lebanon.

Resolution 285: demands immediate Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon.

Resolution 298: deplores Israel's changing of the status of Jerusalem.

Resolution 313: demands that Israel stop attacks against Lebanon.

Resolution 316: condemns Israel for repeated attacks on Lebanon.

Resolution 317: deplores Israel's refusal to release.

Resolution 332: condemns Israel's repeated attacks against Lebanon.

Resolution 337: condemns Israel for violating Lebanon's sovereignty.

Resolution 347: condemns Israeli attacks on Lebanon.

Resolution 425: calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon.

Resolution 427: calls on Israel to complete its withdrawal from Lebanon.

Resolution 444: deplores Israel's lack of cooperation with UN peacekeeping forces.

Resolution 446: determines that Israeli settlements are a serious obstruction to peace and calls on Israel to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention

Resolution 450: calls on Israel to stop attacking Lebanon.

Resolution 452: calls on Israel to cease building settlements in occupied territories.

Resolution 465: deplores Israel's settlements and asks all member states not to assist its settlements program.

Resolution 467: strongly deplores Israel's military intervention in Lebanon.

Resolution 468: calls on Israel to rescind illegal expulsions of two Palestinian mayors and a judge and to facilitate their return.

Resolution 469: strongly deplores Israel's failure to observe the council's order not to deport Palestinians.

Resolution 471: expresses deep concern at Israel's failure to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention.

Resolution 476: reiterates that Israel's claim to Jerusalem are null and void.

Resolution 478: censures (Israel) in the strongest terms for its claim to Jerusalem in its Basic Law.

Resolution 484: declares it imperative that Israel re-admit two deported Palestinian mayors.

Resolution 487: strongly condemns Israel for its attack on Iraq's nuclear facility.

Resolution 497: decides that Israel's annexation of Syria's Golan Heights

is null and void and demands that Israel rescinds its decision forthwith.

Resolution 498: calls on Israel to withdraw from Lebanon.

Resolution 501: calls on Israel to stop attacks against Lebanon and withdraw its troops.

Resolution 509: demands that Israel withdraw its forces forthwith and unconditionally from Lebanon.

Resolution 515: demands that Israel lift its siege of Beirut and allow food supplies to be brought in.

Resolution 517: censures Israel for failing to obey UN resolutions and demands that Israel withdraw its forces from Lebanon.

Resolution 518: demands that Israel cooperate fully with UN forces in Lebanon.

Resolution 520: condemns Israel's attack into West Beirut.

Resolution 573: condemns Israel vigorously for bombing Tunisia in attack on PLO headquarters.

Resolution 587: takes note of previous calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon and urges all parties to withdraw.

Resolution 592: strongly deplores the killing of Palestinian students at Bir Zeit University by Israeli troops.

Resolution 605: strongly deplores Israel's policies and practices denying the human rights of Palestinians.

Resolution 607: calls on Israel not to deport Palestinians and strongly requests it to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention.

Resolution 608: deeply regrets that Israel has defied the United Nations and deported Palestinian civilians.

Resolution 636: deeply regrets Israeli deportation of Palestinian civilians.

Resolution 641: deplores Israel's continuing deportation of Palestinians.

Resolution 672: condemns Israel for violence against Palestinians at the Haram Al-Sharif/Temple Mount.

Resolution 673: deplores Israel's refusal to cooperate with the United Nations.

Resolution 681: deplores Israel's resumption of the deportation of Palestinians.

Resolution 694: deplores Israel's deportation of Palestinians and calls on it to ensure their safe and immediate return.

Resolution 726: strongly condemns Israel's deportation of Palestinians.

Resolution 799: strongly condemns Israel's deportation of 413 Palestinians and calls for their immediate return.

Disclaimer: As far as Im staying on topic, you have no right to blame me for flooding.:)

JAVA

10-28-2005, 05:27 PM

Иранский депутат-еврей ненавидит Израиль

28.10 20:46 | MIGnews.com

Представитель еврейского меньшинства в иранском парламенте Морис Мотамед выступил в поддержку президента Ирана Махмуда Ахмади-Неджада.

По его словам, истинные евреи верующие в Моисея "ненавидят Израиль-узурпатора за варварское поведение сионистского режима", цитирует его слова иранское информационное агентство IRNA.

"Неравная война и столкновения между израильтянами, оснащенными самым современным оружием, и палестинцами, вооруженными камнями, является причиной общественного возмущения", – заявил он журналистам на демонстрации, приуроченной ко Дню Аль-Кудс.

"Призыв Имама (Хомейни – ред.) "стереть Израиль с карты мира" отражает храброе сопротивление Имама как основателя Исламской республики, и все страны должны стремиться к воплощению этого призыва в жизнь. Настоящие евреи вместе с мусульманами борются против Израиля и сионистских преступлений", – добавил депутат.

Все верующие должны продемонстрировать свою поддержку палестинскому народу подчеркнул, Мотамед.

В парламенте Ирана пять депутатских мест забронированы для представителей религиозных общин – 2 для христиан, 2 для зороастрийцев и 1 для еврея.

В Иране проживают около 25.000 евреев. Большинство иранской общины, когда-то являвшейся одной из крупнейших на Ближнем Востоке, покинули страну после исламской революции 1979 года.

__________________________

Zdravo rassujdaet etot evrej deputat. Pobol'she by takih evreev.

JAVA

10-28-2005, 05:40 PM

Nu eto yasniy den'... Prosto i u arabov i u persov mechta odna: unichtojit' Israel... Tol'ko eto u nih uje ne poluchitsya..

U arabov i persov bol'she chem odna mechta. A kajdyj razumnyj chelovek zhelaet unichtozheniya sionistkogo gos-va "Israel", v ne zavisomosti ot nacii i religii. a evreyam ne sionistam posle destrukcii "israeilya" mojno razreshit' jit' v Palestine, na osobyh usloviyah. No reshat' konechno zhe palestincam samim. "israelya " ne budet v budushem eto fakt, tak zhe kak kogda to sterli s karti hrisitanskoe obrazovanie na teritorii Palestiny, kotoroe prodelzhalos' esli ya ne oshibayus' chut' bolee 1oo let. Sionistam eshe 1oo dazhe netu. Kak tol'ko amerika i drugie zapadnye strany perestanut sponsirovat' "islrael" etogo obrazovaniya ne stanet.

UzLand

10-28-2005, 05:41 PM

SHOHRUHM1

10-28-2005, 06:00 PM

tarafdor,

All you said are just bias and emotion mixed views to me. This kind of reply furthers our discussion nowhere. please, refrain from turning to personal level. What I wrote above were my personal views and I have every RIGHT to express them, even if it doesn't match particularly with yours. As you read i clearly marked "IMO" when i said "a hooligan".

You can't argue with "..they are not hooligans ... or did you take part there" like naive arguments. Then it means you don't know too, ... or did you take part in there yourself? No?

It means you don't know enough about modern politics or diplomacy. It is not an arena with gladiators, who have to fight physically in order to survive. Once you are leader you have to put your fantasies aside and use your brain, work strategically. Look, already Canada, Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Sweden, Australia, etc. have urged Iranian officials to apologise publicly, or even they are discussing to suspend Iranian membership in UNO. Iran's f**ed up now. From now on, I bet most of the world class politicians or officials will hesitate to shake hands with Ahmadenejad. He has isolated himself from world community, that imposes a threat to whole Iran of being sanctioned worldwide. You like that?

As about my "IMHO" (his hooliganism) I'd like to back-up it with some articles.
1. Alleged involvement in the 1979 Hostage Crisis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Alleged_involvement_in_the_197 9_Hostage_Crisis)
2. The Iran Focus photograph controversy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#The_Iran_Focus_photograph_cont roversy)
3. Kurdish-Austria Accusations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Kurdish-Austria_Accusations)
4. Political Dissent (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Political_Dissent)
5. Call for the Destruction of Israel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad#Call_for_the_Destruction_of_Is rael)
Firstly, this statement of yours doesn't make sense at all. It's like "blah-blah-blah" ... sorry.

Secondly, can you elaborate on ".. bullshit .." part of my comments precisely, and prove I was wrong on that. I simply said it is undemocratic system in Iran, and I believe every 9 out of 10 will agree with it if they aren't pan-iranists.

FYI:

Do you call it democratic?

Hope you follow it yourself too. It is odd enough to see person's quoting holy Qur'an after the "holy" manners and words he'd uttered.

Thanks.

Sorry to say "G" but Complete nonesense!

Black

10-29-2005, 01:37 AM

stanford , here we go.
I truely believed you can not reply me and post some nonsense crap.
Allahu Akbar!

Does it make any sense to anyone?

If it does not make a sense to anyone does that mean it is moronic idea? LOL again, it is so funny to argue with you stanford.
When I said Iranians are Iranians I meant that Iranians always made and make and will make such statements. No need to jump and cry everytime when Iranians say something about Israel. I had no surprise when I read the news and the reaction towards it. That's what I meant, Iranians are Iranians, it is not first time and it is not last time. No need to whine.
But I don't think it is moronic idea or idea at all. I am sure that you brought this example just to show that "I had moronic ideas in my posts". LOL, could not you found any other argument?

I don't know,maybe the fact that I don't see this as being brainwashed is exactly what makes me brainwashed in your eyes....Ahhh the troubles with understanding.
No comments.

I don't see any reason to believe in your statements than I do for the one you are arguing against.I asked about reliable sources so we can learn better of , for future use.And in this next silly statement do you mean Iranian president has nothing to do with government affairs?
I did not ask you to believe me, but asked just answer my questions in my previous post. Either you do not understand me or you pretend to be so (as long as you have nothing to answer me). I asked about your double standards and etc., questions. And I ask you to link for me, in an scientific way, without your guesses, with the proven facts that Iranian president (or Iran) is going to bomb Israel with its nuclear power station. Just answer the question. Do not "aravani quruq opqochish" or other blaaa, blaaa, that I am moron, extremist, pro-Iranian (whom I am none of them) and etc.

And I did not say and mean that Iranian president has nothing to do with government affairs. Pls, Pls, Pls, just show me a single sentense from the news from your source where it says " Iranian president said (or meant) that Iran has an intention to attack (or to wipe out) Israel [ I believe it should be - Black ] with or without nuclear weapons." Just show me that statment and I will accept that you are right that Iran has no right to produce nuclear weapons. Do not bring me analysis from american neo cons and their allies. Just from the news itself.

I want to know how they will allow, you coudn't bring one.Give me the link.
I won't, if you want to find out the truth search yourself, do not just look for one side of the coin. At least try to find Nuclear Non-prolifation Treaty which is signed by Iran and read it. You can see that ANY country in the world has a right to produce nuclear energy.
Even the US acknowledges that Iran has a right to produce nuclear energy. May be you did not hear or read it, but if you look for the speechs of your beloved Bush and Condi about Iran for the last two months, you can find it.
I can not give you the link (I looked for it where I read) because it has already gone.

"Funny!! Iran is not going to attack Israel,It was just a stupid statement by narrow minded president ,and we will trust our president with "peaceful" thoughts on his mind.Or It will attack Israel,when somebody officially declares it,until,we just sit and wait.Looking for reliable sources from Black."

Pls, don't be (or pretend to be) stupid! I never said that Iran is not going to attack Israel. I said and say, how Iran is going attack Israel with its nuclear power stations. You think you sound funny? No, you sound stupid. Never accuse your opponent with what he never said! Stop being hysteric. I said and say, Iran, as an indepent state and like any other nation has a right to produce nuclear energy,[ nuclear weapon as well] , because not a single international documents prohibit it, as long as they will not transfer it illegally to anybody else. Got me? You can accuse me on this statement as much as you want.

I reread it and found your ignorance.
Ignorance? For what? Or rather for whom? Because I don't agree with you and do not accept your crap I am ignorant? In this case I prefer to be "ignorant" rather than "open minded" (which opens only neo-con ideas)

It will be very helpful once again if you provide these forum members with real news and sources.We are tired of everyday junk news.
It is not my obligation. And do not talk on the others behalf. Just talk on your behalf. If you are tired of everyday junk news, do not watch news and you will be relaxed, God willing.

Have you ever thought about doing something else than constantly posting your silly ideas? [/quote]
Yes, when you can not answer them, my ideas and questions are silly, but if I agree with you I'll become "great and wise" person. Everyody who agree with you is wise and everyone who oppose you silly, isn't it?
Instead of playing with words answer my question I asked there--->
8) Last, but not the least, you spend so much effort to criticise Iranian policy, which did not attack and invade any other country and shut you big mouth up about American policy, which invade any other country which it does not like without any reason, regardless of UN protest? Double standards? Is it called hypocrisy? It is! So stop acting as peace-loving american redneck.
Either the same standards for everybody, or just stop accusing others.

Ok, I do not see any point to argue with you. So far, I did not see any proof that Iranian president said that "Iran has plans to attack Israel (with or without nuclear weapons)". Only some nonsense blaaa, blaaa like "Oh how bad these Iranians are" , "Long live our beloved zionist-fasisht Israel" and etc.,
How unfair the world is. All the whinning here shut up their mouth on the issue of Israel's (who actually invaded Palestine and forced Palestinians to leave there motherland and fatherland, killied, massacred them) nuclear power stations and nuclear warheads (200). Double standards? Yes!

I am leaving this discussion, because I don't see any point with people who sees only one side of the story and close eye to the truth and accuse people on what they did not say.

P.S. Where are all of you whinners when Israel massacre innocent Palestinians? Just answer to you consince not me.

tarafdor

10-29-2005, 04:34 AM

http://www.irna.ir/filesystem/05/10/29/691512-50-15_n.jpg (http://javascript<b></b>:popupImages('http://www.irna.ir/index2.php?option=com_news&task=popup&code=0510296915125015&pindex=&pfrom=0&no_html=1&lang=ru');)«Заявление Президента Ирана Махмуда Ахмадинежада об уничтожении Израиля было направлено не против евреев, а касается сионизма и сионистского оккупационного режима», - заявил в пятницу в интервью корреспонденту ИРНА раввин Давид Вайс, пресс-секретарь американской организации евреев-антисионистов «Нетурей Карта».
«Покойный Имам Хомейни точно определил разницу между иудаизмом и сионизмом, в чем мы убедились, посетив Иран и увидев своими глазами, как в Исламской Республике защищаются права иранских евреев», - отметил раввин и подчеркнул: «Объявленный Имамом Хомейни Всемирный день «аль-Кудс» стал удобным случаем для выражения солидарности мирового сообщества с палестинским народом в его борьбе с сионистским режимом Израиля».
«Иран – не враг еврейского народа, евреи на протяжении тысячелетия мирно жили и живут в Иране бок о бок с мусульманами. А сионизм является политическим движением, и не может представлять весь еврейский народ», - подчеркнул Давид Вайс.
http://www.irna.ir/ru/news/view/line-62/0510296915125015.htm

ДЖИГИТ

10-29-2005, 05:14 AM

Jewish Religious
Opposition To Zionism
By Edward C. Corrigan
Exceprted From Jewish Criticism Of Zionism
10-22-5

Much of the fiercest opposition to Zionism came from the Jewish religious community which attacked its secular nationalism. Akiva Orr, who characterizes himself as a Jewish refugee from Israel, describes this conflict between religion and secularism as follows:

The State of Israel is a secular state: its law, its legislative assembly (the Knesset), and the majority of its population are non-religious. This is hardly surprising as Israel came into existence due to the efforts of a secular political movement motivated by non-religious nationalism, namely political Zionism. In its early days Zionism came into fierce conflict with religious Jewry. The Zionists rejected religious submissiveness; the religious saw the atheist attempt to create a secular Jewish state as blasphemy.19

www.rense.com (http://www.rense.com)

http://www.mepc.org/public_asp/journal/9012_corrigan.asp (http://www.mepc.org/public_asp/journal/9012_corrigan.asp)

Marg'iloniy

10-29-2005, 05:20 AM

Iran says not threatening attack on Israel

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyID=2005-10-29T093641Z_01_HOL724007_RTRUKOC_0_UK-IRAN-ISRAEL.xml

Scofield

10-29-2005, 05:27 AM

let them destroy israel.

http://www.zionists.com/
Zionism: National Socialism for Jews

The Jewish people have never had a friend in both fair and foul weather. Our allies have betrayed us, deserted us in our hour of need, and killed us in unprecedented numbers using crematoria and poison gas. To be Jewish is to know that wherever you go, you'll always have to watch your back.
Even in Israel we are persecuted by another ethnic group, the Arabs, who will not be happy until the last Jew is dead. In Europe, Nationalism is rising in Germany, Russia, France and the Netherlands. Soon there will be no tolerance left for Jews, and we will be exterminated.
Unless we take a stand.
National Zionism is a branch of Kahanism for Jews who don't want to take it lying down. Fight back. Fight for a Jewish state, and for Jewish freedom from all other races. In Israel, only the Jew is the master race, and all others are inferior.
Among Jews, those who are descended from the cohanim, or race of holy Jewish priests, are the equivalent to Aryans in European populations. Our master race will be made from cohanim for the sake of ensuring a Jewish homeland and preservation for Jewish children forever. Adolf Hitler had great wisdom when he realized that no ethnic group can exist without suppressing the inferior races, so that it can breed healthy generations of children in the future. Adolf Hitler was directly responsible for the founding of Israel. Of all the people who have ever dealt with Jews, Rabbi Meir Kahane and Adolf Hitler were the only two honest ones.

Things We Like

The Jewish Task Force (http://www.jtf.org/) - fighting to keep non-whites out of America and Israel's enemies far away.
Kahane.org (http://www.kahane.org/) - all Jews should read this to see what you're really fighting for.
The Jewish Defensive League (http://www.jdl.org.il/) - Protecting the rights of Jews to be free of intolerance and hate crimes.
Anti-Defamation League (http://www.adl.org/) - fighting antisemitism, hatred, racism, andbigotry.
LNSG (http://www.nazi.org/) - Nazis who support Zionism. It's okay, we'll take the help.
Dr. Baruch Goldstein Memorial (http://www.geocities.com/dr_b_goldstein/) - he is a true hero for the Jewish race.

ДЖИГИТ

10-29-2005, 05:42 AM

When speaking of Jewry it is essential to clarify what group we mean Zionist Jews or jewry or Orthodox jews. In a case of current Israel state we mean Zionist jews who are equal to Hitler facists, however orthodox jews are quite religious people and in most matters go along with islamic teachings due to the fact that orthodox jews are followers of Judaism, church of Moses (peace be upon him). Followers of every prophet must unite, since there is no major difference in teachings but the name and traditions, for peace and stability on earth.

Scofield

10-29-2005, 05:48 AM

uki

10-29-2005, 05:48 AM

...I doubt two wars at the same time in Iraq and Iran.
...

Inka ti obsolyutno prava no s administraciey Busha vse vozmojno, nekotorim iz pentagona(lobbiruyushim israel) vigodno natravit' ameriku na iran, a nash dyadushka Bush bol'she slushayet svoix sovetnikov(podderjivayushie nekotorie ideologii) chem real'no smotret' na politicheskuyu situaciyu na tom regione...

mosh amirikosev na sotni raz bol'she chem mosh irana i eto doet im povod ne tak uj gluboko dumat' pered tem kak nastupat na nee...

...
This was a very, very wrong thing to say by him.

absoluyutno s toboy soglasen, bunaqa gapti cho'pon ham etmidi, bir prezidentning etishini tasavvur qilolmayapman...

Scofield

10-29-2005, 05:54 AM

let russia to support for nuclear/biological/cemical mineral/weapon transfer to the Iran.

we do not need a boss of the world (usa+israel alliance)

Amiri Turkiston

10-29-2005, 11:09 AM

let russia to support for nuclear/biological/cemical mineral/weapon transfer to the Iran.

we do not need a boss of the world (usa+israel alliance)

good point bro.

we don't need such a boss who will manipulate everything and order the music for us

Zamon

10-29-2005, 11:15 AM

Президент Ирана уволил послов в Великобритании, Франции и ФРГ

Президент Ирана Махмуд Ахмадинеджад уволил своих послов в Великобритании, Франции и Германии. Об этом сообщил правительственный источник изданию Iran Focus. Кроме того, еще 18 послов были вызваны в Тегеран на консультации.

«Ахмадинеджад был разгневан тем, что он видит, покорной реакцией послов по поводу глобального осуждения его речи против Израиля и Запада», - рассказал источник на условиях анонимности.

Источник также отметил, что командующий Исламской революционной гвардии, спикер парламента, генеральный секретарь Национального совета безопасности и министр разведки и безопасности поддержали речь Ахмадинеджада, в которой он заявил, что Израиль должен быть «стерт с карты мира». Как заявил источник, они «говорят всем не бояться угроз военных действий со стороны Запада, называя их блефом», передает "Аль-Джазира".

Свое заявление», вызвавшее конфликт с западными странами, президент Ирана сделал на конференции «Мир без сионизма», которая состоялась в здании иранского МВД. На следующий день Ахмадинеджад еще больше обострил конфликт, назвав США и Израиль «наглыми существами». Лидеры европейских стран, Россия и США осудили выступление Ахмадинеджада. В европейских столицах иранские послы были вызваны властями для разъяснений. числе и в России) были вызваны МИДами этих государств для дачи объяснений.

// Газета.Ru

Постоянный адрес данной страницы:
http://www.gazeta.ru/2005/10/29/last176025.shtml

Bednye Posly, oni zhe ved' diplomaty i horosho znayut chto oznochaet slovo "steret iz zemli" celuyu stranu. Choknuty Prezident Irana hotel chtoby Posly stranah Zapada tozhe vyshli s podderzhkoi nelepyh idej svoego Prezidenta. eto eshe odin znak dlya Rossii i Kitaya podderzhat ili net Iran. a Prezident Iran hotel etogo ili net dal kart blansh tem chem Everejem i Amerikancam.

JAVA

10-29-2005, 12:07 PM

Президент Ирана уволил послов в Великобритании, Франции и ФРГ

Президент Ирана Махмуд Ахмадинеджад уволил своих послов в Великобритании, Франции и Германии. Об этом сообщил правительственный источник изданию Iran Focus. Кроме того, еще 18 послов были вызваны в Тегеран на консультации.

«Ахмадинеджад был разгневан тем, что он видит, покорной реакцией послов по поводу глобального осуждения его речи против Израиля и Запада», - рассказал источник на условиях анонимности.

Источник также отметил, что командующий Исламской революционной гвардии, спикер парламента, генеральный секретарь Национального совета безопасности и министр разведки и безопасности поддержали речь Ахмадинеджада, в которой он заявил, что Израиль должен быть «стерт с карты мира». Как заявил источник, они «говорят всем не бояться угроз военных действий со стороны Запада, называя их блефом», передает "Аль-Джазира".

Свое заявление», вызвавшее конфликт с западными странами, президент Ирана сделал на конференции «Мир без сионизма», которая состоялась в здании иранского МВД. На следующий день Ахмадинеджад еще больше обострил конфликт, назвав США и Израиль «наглыми существами». Лидеры европейских стран, Россия и США осудили выступление Ахмадинеджада. В европейских столицах иранские послы были вызваны властями для разъяснений. числе и в России) были вызваны МИДами этих государств для дачи объяснений.

// Газета.Ru

Постоянный адрес данной страницы:
http://www.gazeta.ru/2005/10/29/last176025.shtml

.

Vse bol'she i bol'she ya nachinayu uvazhat' prezidenta Irana. Hochu zametit' Ahmadinejad sdelal svoe zayavlenie na schet sionistov, i na sleduyushij den' dlya osobo odarennyh povtoril eshe raz, eto znachit chto on dejstvitel'no ne boitsya voennyh dejstvij so storony usa, i tem bolee licerov iz evropy.

Martingale

10-29-2005, 12:08 PM

Good job on the research. Israel has ignored all the resolutions:)

Actually I got it somewhere, but forgot to give the link.:) Sure, a good job!;)

ДЖИГИТ

10-29-2005, 02:32 PM

Bilo bi esho luchshe esli Iran vishvirnul amerikosov i ego soyuznikov iz Iraqa marsh broskom svoih voysk vglub' Iraka. Amerika ne v sostoyanii protivostoyat', iraqskoe soprotivlenie nastol'ko oslabilo ekonomiku Ameriki, chto shtati ne v silah budut protivostoyat' i budut vinujdeni pokinut' Irak, horoshiy moment dlya etogo. da i nikto, ni Rossiya ni drugie strani ne smogut sdelat' nichego korme kak nalojit' sanktsii, k tomu je voyna v Irake illegal, nezakonnoe vtorjenie v suverennuyu respubliku bez razresheniya UN. Edinstvennoe, irantsam i raqtsam nujno dumat' ob ob'edinenii na danniy moment.

The Hidden
History Of
Zionism
(http://www.marxists.de/middleast/schoenman/)

UzLand

10-29-2005, 06:56 PM

Vse bol'she i bol'she ya nachinayu uvazhat' prezidenta Irana. Hochu zametit' Ahmadinejad sdelal svoe zayavlenie na schet sionistov, i na sleduyushij den' dlya osobo odarennyh povtoril eshe raz, eto znachit chto on dejstvitel'no ne boitsya voennyh dejstvij so storony usa, i tem bolee licerov iz evropy.

То, что он ничего не боится, еще ни о чем не говорит. Саддам тоже совсем никого не боялся. Просто такими заявлениями они дают повод. Бушу лижь бы был повод.

tarafdor

10-29-2005, 09:45 PM

То, что он ничего не боится, еще ни о чем не говорит. Саддам тоже совсем никого не боялся. Просто такими заявлениями они дают повод. Бушу лижь бы был повод.

Bilo bi glupo sravnivat Iran i Iraq. Na kogo opiralsa Saddam ,yego je prodali uje do voyni.
Lanat bo Isroil, Lanat bo Amriqo.

Scofield

10-30-2005, 03:21 AM

good point bro.

we don't need such a boss who will manipulate everything and order the music for usgreetings bro. i bet now some Americanized-Uzbeks are angry to me =))

JAVA

10-30-2005, 05:08 PM

То, что он ничего не боится, еще ни о чем не говорит. Саддам тоже совсем никого не боялся. Просто такими заявлениями они дают повод. Бушу лижь бы был повод.

Ne nado sravnivat' vseh podryad s saddamom, i tem bolee Prezidenta Irana Ahmedinejada. Za saddamom ne stoyal nikto, ego nenavidel svoj zhe narod, on dazhe ne smog spryatat'sya, tak kak nikto ne hotel dat' emu ubezhishe. Vozmite k primeru Amira Abu Musab Al Zarqawi, kotoryj polzuetsya ogromnoj podderzhskoj iraqskogo naroda ( po krayne mere sunni), tol'ko blagodarya etoj podderzhke on uspeshno voyuet protiv okupantov. A teper' predstav'te kakaya podderzhka sredi svoego naroda u demokraticheski izbranogo prezidenta Irana??? Mozhet li boyatsya kogo ili chego libo chelovek kotorogo podderzhivaet sobstvennyj narod??? Tem bolee lyubuyu voennuyu agressiyu so storony ameriki i tem bolee sionistov Iran v sostayaenie otrazit', i eto znayut kak i sionisty tak i amerikanci. bush kakim by pridurkom ne byl, 5 raz podumaet chem napast' na Iran, ili zhe Siriyu. I pushechnogo myasa uzhe ne ostalos', esli tol'ko ne vvedut draft.
Ostaetsya tol'ko variant esli sionisty i amerikanci natravyat kakuyu nibud' 2 stanu protiv Irana, ili zhe popytayutsya ustroit' besporyadki vnutri strany.

fgerfr

10-31-2005, 01:09 AM

Невероятно, но не исключено, что американцы решатся на нанесение удара по Ирану и без возни с согласованиями с членами Совета Безопасности ООН (кто-то может что-то противопоставить абсолютной гегемонии Запада?). Нанести удар неожиданно и максимально мощно в надежде на скорый и лёгкий успех. Теракты в Индии, скорее всего, организовали те же американцы (не хочется думать, что индусы пошли на сговор с ними) по следам "недопустимых" заявлений президента Ирана. Мол, речь главы Ирана следует рассматривать как призыв к действиям. И террористы прекрасно это поняли, совершив террористические акты в Нью-Дели. Кто-то хочет выстроить "нужную" цепочку событий из всего того, что происходит в мире. Сначала "весь цивилизованный мир" совершенно справедливо осудил известные заявления иранского главы, а потом обратил их в свою пользу взрывами и гибелью невинных граждан Индии в столице этого государства.

tarafdor

10-31-2005, 01:55 AM

Vozmite k primeru Amira Abu Musab Al Zarqawi, kotoryj polzuetsya ogromnoj podderzhskoj iraqskogo naroda ( po krayne mere sunni), tol'ko blagodarya etoj podderzhke on uspeshno voyuet protiv okupantov

Neujeli vi dumayete chto vse tot je Zarqavi sushestvuyet, ili je spet naz ameriki deystvuyet ot yego je imeni...:lol:

stanford

10-31-2005, 11:17 AM

Rafsanjani said muslims should use nuclear weapon against Israel here (http://www.iran-press-service.com/articles_2001/dec_2001/rafsanjani_nuke_threats_141201.htm) (Old but supportive)

TEHRAN 14 Dec. (IPS)
One of Iran’s most influential ruling cleric called Friday on the Muslim states to use nuclear weapon against Israel, assuring them that while such an attack would annihilate Israel, it would cost them "damages only".

Ahmadinejad's comments about "wiping Israel off the map", wasn't for any kind of religion concerned statement, it was for national reasons. I don't think he is just a stupid, and I think he knew exactly what he was saying.

JAVA

10-31-2005, 06:26 PM

Neujeli vi dumayete chto vse tot je Zarqavi sushestvuyet, ili je spet naz ameriki deystvuyet ot yego je imeni...:lol:

Ya uveren chto Abu Mesab al Zarqawi sushestvuet. Uverenost' moya v tom chto v etom godu on stal Amirom Al Qaidy v Mesopatamii, ego priznal sam Osama Bin Laden. Dalee regulyarnye video, i audio obrashenie k Umme podtverzhdayut ego sushestvovanie, ne schitaya neskol'ko biograficheskih filmov, kotorye mozhno nayti v inete. NO, v to zhe vremya amerikanci vpolne mogut deystvovat' ot imeni AL Zarqawi, a imenno provodit' terrakty, i vse valit' na boycov Zarqawi. Tak chto odno drugoe ne isklyuchaet.

fgerfr

11-01-2005, 07:38 AM

Точно. Одно другое не исключает и даже, более того, подразумевает. Надо будет нам покажут такое "регулярное видео" и представят нам такие "обращения к умме", которые вам и не снились в самом страшном сне и, самое главное, эти "познавательные материалы", так же, как и всё последнее время, будут исходить от террористов и борцов с террористами в одном лице...

Ya uveren chto Abu Mesab al Zarqawi sushestvuet. Uverenost' moya v tom chto v etom godu on stal Amirom Al Qaidy v Mesopatamii, ego priznal sam Osama Bin Laden. Dalee regulyarnye video, i audio obrashenie k Umme podtverzhdayut ego sushestvovanie, ne schitaya neskol'ko biograficheskih filmov, kotorye mozhno nayti v inete. NO, v to zhe vremya amerikanci vpolne mogut deystvovat' ot imeni AL Zarqawi, a imenno provodit' terrakty, i vse valit' na boycov Zarqawi. Tak chto odno drugoe ne isklyuchaet.

var

11-01-2005, 08:06 AM

JAVA

11-01-2005, 06:41 PM

Да ладно вам....есть такая пословица.
На словах он Лев Толстой а на деле *** простой. У Ирана пупок развяжется при попытке воевать с Израилем или при попытке выкинуть Америкосов из Ирака.
Не надо забывать что и во Вьетнаме, и в Авганистане сталкивались две супердержавы, это США и СССР. А сейчас совсем другие времена и сравнивать то что было тогда и то что есть сейчас безсмысленно...

Eto skoree vsego u sionistov pupok razvyazhetsya. Voevat' s Iranom eto ne ubivat' bezoruzhnyh zhenshin, detej i starikov. I ne polit' s vertoleta po mirnym demostrantam. A iranci umeyut voevat', chto podtverdila vojna s Iraqom.
Sionisty ne smogut vesti boevye dejstviya na protyazhenie dlitel'nogo vremeni, ne hvatit ne material'nyh ne chelovechskih resursov. A amerikancev vikunut iz Iraqa bez pomoshi irancev.

Guardian

12-12-2005, 03:34 AM

Махмуд Ахмади Неджад наконец раздразнил Израиль так, что тот превратился в мартовскую кошку, метущуюся вдоль Иордана в неодолимом желании слиться с Исламской Республикой в кромешном ядерном экстазе. Израиль задумал разрушить секретные ядерные объекты Ирана, и мирные, и воображаемые военные, которые, кстати, уже напугали полмира. В марте 2006 г. Израиль атакует дерзкую восточную страну, пошлет на ее секретные долины авиацию, а если после этого Иран осмелится получить хоть крохотную щепотку обогащенного урана, Израиль напустит в его атомные кущи бравых пехотинцев, и уж они-то точно разделаются с нерадивыми центрифугами.

Важно отметить, что эта информация поступила из военных источников, но не из правительственных кругов.

Израильские военные надеются точечными ударами сокрушить мощь иранской ядерной индустрии и таким образом превратить Ахмади Неджада в тряпку. Впрочем, как известно, даже "мирный" атом при артиллерийской и авиационной обработке становится довольно эффективной экологической отравой для соседних стран. Однако, по мнению Израиля, возлежать на челе планеты и стряхивать с могучих плеч радиоактивную перхоть куда приятнее, чем быть "навсегда стертым" с этой планеты. Напомним, что иранский лидер однажды не вытерпел и призвал "стереть Израиль с карты мира"; на робкое возмущение мирового сообщества Ахмади Неджад ответил дипломатическим хамством.

istochniki stat'i
http://centrasia.org/news.php4?st=1134380100
http://utro.ru