Nimaga hamma Toshkentda qolishni istaydi??? [Archive] - Uzbekistan Online Forum

General'

10-28-2001, 06:37 AM

Javoblari:
1) yashash sharoiti ancha yahshi
2) oylik kam bo'lgani bilan levalari ko'p
3) hamma kommunal hizmatlar deyarli qoniqarli
4) markaz, karyera qilishga juda yahshi
5) hamma yahshi narsalar Toshkentda, masalan Matiz sotuvga chiqdi, hozir esa faqat Toshkentda sotilmoqda, keyinroq, ya'ni in a few months, regionlarda ya'ni kambag'al viloyatlarda sotilarmish. Yangi superlux binolar, offislar, FDI qo'shma korhonalar(menimcha 24%) hamma hammasi Toshknetda.

Viloyatlarda esa...
1) yahshash sharoiti yahshi emas
2) kommunal hizmatlar: gaz, issiq suv degan narsalar yo'qligining yaqinda 10 yilligini nishonlashdi. O'zimizda gaz konlari bo'lib turib, qishda ovqat qilishga gaz yo'q, odamlar pechkaga o'tin yoqishadi. Yaqinda bittasi ochilibdi: Muborakda, bu gaz koni shubhasiz yurtimiz iqtisodiy rivoji uchun foydalaniladi debdi.Bilmadim qanaqa iqtisodiy rivojlanish haqida gap ketyapti. Odamlarning yahshash sharoitimi yoki Makriiqtisodstatdagi raqamlarning ko'payishimi???
3) Ishdayam juda qiynavorishadi, Toshkentdan mehmon kelarmish, Toshkentdan komissiya, Toshkentni buyrgug'i, yoqsayam yoqmasayam qil!
4) Yaqinda Vodiyda(bilmadim boshqa viloyatlarda qanaqa) benzin krizisi bo'ldi. 160 so'mlik benzin qo'lda 300gacha ko'tarildi. Yahshiyam neft konlarimiz bor, Farg'onada,Buhoroda supergigant neftni qayta ishlash zavodlari bor, bo'lmasa 1000 so'm bo'larmidi.
Aytmoqchi, telefon qiluvdim, u krizis haliyam davom etyapti ekan.

Shunaqa, bunga hech kim yaqin orada e'tibor bermaydi shekilli. Hamma rivojlangan davlatlar regional policy bilan rivojlangan va hozir ham shu siyosat bor. Bizda esa bitta Toshkent ham respublika ham region.

Bunsha Ivan Vasiylich

10-28-2001, 08:13 PM

man boshqalarni bilamdimu, lekin man baribir Farg'onaga qaytmoqchiman! Toshkentda yashash uchun sharoitlar qulayroq bolgani bilan, social tomondan qiyin... tushunganlar tushunadi. I vashe kim aytdi bizda gaz yoki issiq suv yoq deb, naverna deep viliagelarda yoqdir.
A tak soqa bolsa lyuboy joyda yashasa boladi, kak govoritsya s mylom i v shalashe ray:))

elDoraDo

10-28-2001, 09:15 PM

a tak man braziliyaga surmoqchiman

Tank

10-28-2001, 11:45 PM

Mda man esa Tank ichida kolaman tak nadojnei.

General'

10-29-2001, 04:35 AM

Ivan Vasilich , gaz bor lekin qishdayam bormi? Deep villagelarni qo'yib turing, tuman markazlarida ham yo'q qishda, men bunga kafolat beraman. Ichimlik suv sistemasi borgan sari yomonlashmoqda, odamlar ariqdan yoki daryodan suv ichadi.
Keyin bir solishtirib ko'rganmisiz Toshkent bilan shu Farg'onada odamlarning kiyinishinini, bozorlarini, ishlash sharoitlarini?
Bemalol Farg'onaga suriyishiyiz mumkin, soqqa bo'lsa hamma yerda hayot zo'r, lekin men buni nazarda tutmay, balki tuzukroq regional siyosat yuritish kerakmikan degandim.
O'rtacha ahvolni qarang viloyatlarda, Toshkentdagi mardirkor bozorning 99%i viloyatlardan. Ishsizlik, pulsizlik va h.k. sababli odamlar Qozog'istonga , Rossiyaga, ishlagani ketishyapti, novvoy bo'libmu yoki daraht kesibmi.
Bilmadimu, lekin Farg'onada ham bo'layotgandir bu holatlar.

Hayotga real ko'z bilan qarash kerak.

amak

10-29-2001, 05:43 AM

Regional riwojlanish siyosatini
kuchaytirish kerakligiga koshilaman.
Lekin unga hozir soqqa qaegdan kelsin?
Chet el kreditlari ham ulkaga shoshilaetganfa
uhshamiydi.
Mablag yogligida hech bulmasa Toshkent kuz-kuzchilikka (yani "risowka", yani "pokasuha"-ga)yaralibtursa bolgani.

amak

10-29-2001, 05:44 AM

BOLALAR'

10-29-2001, 06:00 AM

Da General juda tugri aytgan. Shuncha harakat kilib bilim olib viloyatga ketgandan, oz yoling uchun Toshkentda kurashganing yahshirok. Eng asosiysi koprok imkoniyat. Regional siyosat boldi endi bu narsa yakin ortada amalga oshmidi. Hususiylashtirish tugrisida kop gapirildi. Er hali ham davlat ihtiyorida, fermerlar nomiga fermer. Etkazilgan mahsulotni sotish vaktida unda hech kanaka HUKUK degan narsa kolmaydi. albatta bitta joyga va usha joy belgilagan narhda sotishi kerak. Bu narsaga astoydil hali beri e'tior berilmasa kerak deb oylamayman. Bitta oddiy hakikat bor, bu toshkentda kolmokchi bolayotgan bollar osha patriotlardan hech kanaka kam joyi yok fakat. Birovlarniku saklay olmisan hech bolmasa ozingni saklab kol degan ma'noda. Viloyatga borib ahvolni ozgartira olmaydi demak hech bolmasa ozini ahvolini ozgartiradi Toshkentda kolib. Yana kim biladi.

Ivan Vasilevich yoki Shurik:) Frunzkiy Massiveda Gaz Uje yok ekan. Kortni oldidagi Petrol stationda benzinni narhi 240 ekan. Ekonomicani yurfakni bollari hali pahtadan kelmabdi:((( those are simple examples.

Ptichku jalko

keep in touch

......shunoslarga salom!
regards

uzbek immigrant in USA

10-29-2001, 08:52 AM

Attention: General
What`s your point bringing this matter to piblic attention?
First of all, you mentioned that lifestyle and life condition was better then other regions of the country, but I am not supporting your idea or opinion. As far as, how people live in other as you have said " kollok viloytalar" regions, no matter where you came from or live in Uzbekistan, whether in Tashkent or Ferghana, this is called Uzbekisan.. one country and nation
if there are still problems in other regions that means there will be problem in Tashkent too..
what? is Tashkent in another country? or tashkent population is different race or with diffrent background? every single citizen who consider himslef/herself son and daugther of this land has right to use and enjoy all resources and benefits. If economy remains unstable in "kollok viloyatlar" remember tashkent will not be tashkent you dream about.
one more thing, most tashkent people have different attitude then other people who live in other part of country, they think about only themselves, just like you do Mr General.. who call himself ***** i have no description for you.. figure it out yourself..
do not ever try to get me and you won`t
I have met so many students from Tashkent city..
I would say (f**** those people, stupid arrogant a****s) you wanna know why?
then follow me:
but, this is good if life and economy good in tashkent, I am glad.. at least capital Tashkent is in good condtion.
not only does tashkent represent whole country or nation, remember this kid..
" uzbek nation is great and strong with high loyal and great history"
I want you to think and solve those people`s problems who have not poor water or any other demands for population instead of pointing out and making yourself proud of being in tashkent
i am not happy with your message.

thank you.

TOG'ORA Inc.

10-29-2001, 08:58 AM

a man bugun mentlaga 4000 ming berdim... aniqrog'i shilvolishdi...
pravilani buzganlik uchun...
bog'lanishni sezmaganlar iltimos, piching qilmasin

Bunsha Ivan Vasiylich

10-29-2001, 11:30 AM

koroche, birodar, bunaqa topiklarni ochishdan oldin fikrlarizi to'plab oling. Sizi olgan approach-iz vosh'em notog'ri, nima demoqchi bolganizi (i.e.,regionlarda qiyin ahvol) toshkentni hammadan ustun qoyib emas, balki Toshkentda o'tirgan poraho'r byurokratlardan sabab topib, gapni boshlasangiz bolar edi, muhtaram. O'zi toshkentda sizga o'hshaganlar ancha ko'pi topiladi. Toshkentni Toshkent qilgan faktorlarni oylamasdan, biz hammadan zormiz, qolganlar esa harip deb ko'kragiga urib yuradiganlar kopchilikni taskil etadi. Toshkent nisbatan boy ekan, a nimaga boy deb oylab kormadizimi? Viloyatlardan hamma pul (tax and etc.) osha erga oqib kelsa, uni ustiga katta miqdorda nelegalniy pullar u erga oqib kirib amalda otirganlarni boy qilayotgan bolsa konyushnya toshkent boyidi. Buni hammasi regionlarni hisobiga bolayotganini oylab koradigan odamlar topilib qolarmikin? O'ziz oylab koring, agar hokimiyatdagi top official Toshkentga cho'tal olib bormasa u official kreslosida o'tirarmikin? Demak chotal olib borishi kerak ekan, u pulni bir erdan chiqarish kerak-ku? U kimdan chiqaradi? viloyatda yashayotgan oddiy halq hisobiga chiqaradi, t.e., porahorlik qilib, o'q'irlik qilib, halqni chontagini qurutadi. A bunday sharoitda qanaqa rivojlanish boladi, janobi oliylari?
Regionlarda g'amni eb qoyadigan bir qiyin shariotda balanddan kelib, biz hammadan zormiz deb gapirishiz etmay turovdi hali.
Bu shitty sistemni ozgartirish kerak, bolmasam hali beri rivojlana ololmimiz. Masalan, man Farg'onaga qaytib, viloyat ekonomikasini rivojlanishiga hissa qo'shaman deb business ochsam, a etda otirgan poraho'rlar mani belimga tepib, "g'ildiraklarimiga tahta tiqib" otirishsa, man va boshqa dostlarimiz O'zbekisatnni rivojlanishi uchun qanoq qilib hissa qosha ololarmikinmiz?
O'zbekistondagi hukumat ustida haloli pok, vatanparvar insonlar o'tirganda edi, hozirgi sharoitda bolams edik.

Omon bo'linglar.

uzbek immigrant in USA

10-29-2001, 02:31 PM

Hi! How do you do Bunsha Ivan Vasiylich!
I think you made it clear. good job..
thank you and all who care and think about entire country`s problems not only tashkent`s

Have a Nice Day!

xurmat ila
vatandoshingiz

General'

10-30-2001, 07:40 AM

Bo'ldimi, gapirib bo'ldinglarmi?
Endi eshitinglar:

uzbek immigrant ,
Just open your big eyes even bigger, alright.
And read my previuos posts very carefully. And respond it accordingly. Don't be so emotional, keep your nerves.
Tashkent is a chief city, I admit. I also admit that "amak"'s idea who said "yani "risowka", yani "pokasuha"-ga)yaralib tursa bolgani."
Also I never called the people willing to stay in Tashkent kind of impatriots, egoists, even no words. Maybe I support them, as BOLALAR. I pointed the factors, reasons of huge difference between Tashkent and other places.
I meant to direct more investments, more attention to viloyats as well. I meant parallel development. I meant that more international conferences, exhibitions should be held in viloyats too. I did not separate Tashkent(like a foreign country) from other places as well as its people. I have never said that I am proud of being in Tashkent and in fact I am not in TAHSKENT.

Is that clear, dear uzbek immigrant???

"one more thing, most tashkent people have different attitude then other people who live in other part of country, they think about only themselves, just like you do Mr General.. who call himself ***** i have no description for you.. figure it out yourself..
do not ever try to get me and you won`t
I have met so many students from Tashkent city..
I would say (f**** those people, stupid arrogant a****s) you wanna know why?"

This abusive language should not be used, as I have not offended anyone in my posts. You do not know me at all, so you can't simply judge me, OK? And therefore, YOU OWE ME AN APPOLOGY, PUBLIC APPOLOGY .

One more question:for how long have you attending in DB? It seems to me that you are to young for such discussions because you are not answering/ responding to exact topics and you ideas does seem to be out of logical order.

General'

10-30-2001, 08:08 AM

Hurmatli Ivan Vasilich ,
Men tushunmadim, siz nimaga bunchalik sachrab ketdingiz?
Sizga nisbatan qo'pol gap ishlamadim shekilli.
Endi siz ham eshiting:
Ozbekcha yahshi tushunsangiz, men qachon Toshkentni hammadan ustun qo'ydim? Men aksincha shu ustun qo'yilishini tanqid qilib, hammaga teng ko'z bilan qaralsin, ya'ni regional siyosat yuritilsin demabmidim.

Yoki buni tushunmadingizmi?

Toshkentni boy bo'lish sabablarini hamma biladi, buni sanab o'tishingiz shart emasdi. Keyin qalbaki vatanparvarlik ham menimcha kerak emasdi, gas masalasida, benzin masalasida.
Men viloyatlarda ham kommunal hizmatlar yahshilansa, hamma investitsiya Toshkentga qilinmasdan, hammaga teng ko'z bilan qaralsa dedim.
"O'zi toshkentda sizga o'hshaganlar ancha ko'pi topiladi. Toshkentni Toshkent qilgan faktorlarni oylamasdan, biz hammadan zormiz, qolganlar esa harip deb ko'kragiga urib yuradiganlar kopchilikni taskil etadi."
Men kimga o'hshabman? His tuyg'uga berilmang. sizga samimiy maslahatim.

Keyin men hech qaysi bir Toshkentda qolish istagida yurganlarni tanqid qilmadim. Shahsan mening ko'p sinfdosh kursdoshlarim qolmoqda. Men shu sabablarni umumiy qilib sizlarga post qildim holos.

Oddiy halq deb qayg'uribsiz, bu yahshi. Men yuqorida issiq suz, gaz deb aytsam , nega bu faqat deep villagelarda dedingiz? BU firklaringizning qarama qarshi kelib qolishi emasmi?
Deep villagedagi oddiy halq emasmi? Tem bolee sizning shahriyizdayam kommunal hizmatlar, benzin-gaz taqchilligi 100% ijobiy hal etilmagan shekilli?
Endi O'zbekiston Hukumatiga kelsak, hammani tengdaniga poraho'rlikda, o'girlikda ayblabsiz, bu boshqa mavzu endi. Bunaqa tanqid salkam "moda" bo'lib qoldi. Sal bo'lmasa revolyutsiya qivorasilar.
Bu sistemani oz'gartirib, hukumatga 100% happa halol odam qo'yish - bu oyda hayot bo'lganda, buqa bolalaganda, va fevralning 30chi kuni bo'ladi.
Shunga unaqa behuda orzularga berilmay, sal pal bo'ladigan hayotiy masalalarga vaqt sarflasangiz, meninmcha yahshi ish bo'lardi.

Qizishmang reply qilganda.

underloaded

10-30-2001, 08:42 AM

General', I support you.

Oblast-mi, shahar-mi o'zimizga o'hshagan odamlar. Hammasini umidi bor, farzandi bor... O'zbekiston aholisini ko'p qismi oblastda yashaydi. Buni unitish kerak emas.

Cheers

OPTIMIST'

10-30-2001, 09:52 AM

I am learning to price options, and other derivative instruments, and i really enjoy it,

hmm, sounds like, i'll implement hedging against political, corruption risk using derivatives in my REGION, also benefit from market inefficiencies to make money, LoooooooL, anyway,

i hope you got my opinion, guys! sthg is missing, that will keep people in regions,

GEN, keep it up

OPTIMIST ;p

cute

10-30-2001, 11:04 AM

Karoche,
Uzbek immigrant in the USA,

Betta o'zizzi vatanparvar qilib ko'rsatishni keragi yo'q. Hammamiz ham vatanparvar, o'z tug'ilib o'sgan yerimizda, o'zimiz taniydigan odamlar orasida yashab, o'sha yerdan jamiyatga foyda keltirishni o'ylaymiz.

every single citizen who consider himslef/herself son and daugther of this land has right to use and enjoy all resources and benefits.

Bu nima konstitutsiyangizmi bratan? Balandparvozroq emasmikin :)

Undan keyin manimcha General' Toshkentni ustun qo'ygani yo'q. qo'ymaydi ham. Yuqorida keltirgan hamma narsa fakt. va nuqta.

undan tashqari, bu yerda "feelingsni" bildirishni hojati yo'q.

I have met so many students from Tashkent city..
I would say (f**** those people, stupid arrogant a****s) you wanna know why?

Hohlagan regiondan hohlagancha bunaqa odamlarni topib berish mumkin.

Asosiy masala esa, borib viloyat hokimiyatni bir sassiq burchagida ishlaganingizdan keyin biron nimalar aniq bo'p qolar.

Huddi shu narsa Ivan Vasiyevichga ham.

Toshkent boyroq degan gapni boleznenno qabul qilibsiz. Hech kim sabablari haqida so'ragani ham yo'qku. Savol nimaga hamma Toshkentta qolishni istaydi deyilgan. And no need to get personal.
Lekin bu sistemani o'zgartirish kerakligiga qo'shilaman. Ammo hammamiz bilamiz yaqin orada o'zgarmaydi, singib ketgan.

Misha

10-30-2001, 01:30 PM

I support uzbek immigrant`s idea..
.. immigrant.. yeah..
uzbeks in America Rock!

sure

10-30-2001, 05:39 PM

misha, ivan va usadagi uzbek immigrant - LOL :)

masalani tushunish uchun topicni qayta qayta oqiyla, up to 100 times :) agar shundayam tushunmasela foydasi yoq ekan, uzr a tak

General, qale ishla? shu ketganimdan beri gaplasholmadim siz bilan, ha mayli, viloyatlar masalasiga keladigan bosak, tak, viloyatlarda sharoit yoq haqiqatdan, hamma soqqayam nuqul toshkentga oqib keladi, umidchilar va umuman boshqa odamlar ham ming vatanparvar bogani hayotga bilan real koz bilan qarab, toshkentga kochib oshatta ornashib olishni oylidi, togri qiladiyam, agarda kadrlar viloyatda qolishini hohlasak oshatta shunga yarasha sharoit yaratilishi kerak. chet elda shuncha oqib oqib viloyatta biron qishloqda ptizefabrikani ekonomisti bolib ishlash bomapti :) vot gde masala kondalang lejit

peace

-sure

Bunsha

10-30-2001, 09:02 PM

General,
man bekorga o'z topikimi:"General, fikrlaizi to'plab oling" deb boshlaganim yoq. Man etta yozib qoyibman asosiy masala nima haqida ketayotganini tushungandim deb.
General, sizi postizda viloyatlarni qiyin sharoti haqida yozibsiz man buni bilaman. Lekin bu haqda gapirayotganizda gaplarizi ba'zilari ambitious bo'lib ko'ringanlarini sezmadizmi? Misol uchun, u wrote: "hamma yahshi narsalar Toshkentda, masalan Matiz sotuvga chiqdi, hozir esa faqat Toshkentda sotilmoqda, keyinroq, ya'ni in a few months, regionlarda ya'ni kambag'al viloyatlarda sotilarmish...." - bu va boshqa shunga o'hshash gaplariz haqida yana bir yahshilab oylab ko'ring, viloyatlikni ko'zi bilan qarab ko'ring, shunda nima "ne-to" chiqib qolganini bilib qolarsiz. Hotya, Toshkentlik bo'lsangiz balki sezmaysizdir...
Dal'she, sizni gapizda mani irritate qilib yuborgan narsa bu: yoq,man baribir Farg'onaga qiyin ahvol bolsa ham ketmoqchiman deb fikr bildirganimdan keyin, siz postizda: "Bemalol Farg'onaga surishingiz mumkin..."-deb appeal qilganiz, manga huddi man kulgu va some sort of kritikaga uchraganimday ko'rindi. Shu bilan dastlabki vatanparvar fikrlariz mani ko'zimda qarama-qarshilikka uchradi. Shuning uchun ochiq niyatli ekansiz, fikrlarizi bir tomonlama toplab olsangiz deb maslahat bergandim. Gaplarmi yahshilab analiz qiling, shunda hamma ??? -larizga javob topasiz.
Gazga kelsak, 1 yil oldin shahrimda bunday problemani experience qilmodim, but possibly nowadays it is actual problem.

Cute, viloyat hokimiyatini bir "sassiq" burchagiga borib, chirib yotish niyatim yoq va boshqalar ham viloyatlarga bunday "orzu" bilan qaytishmidi shekili. Albatta bu bollarni fikrida business bilan shug'ullanish bor. Endi hamma Toshkentda ko'tarilaman, yoki baks tolaydigan joyga kirib olaman deb ketaversa, viloyatlarda kim qoladi? Toshkentni rivojlantirib qoyish bilan viloyatlarga ta'siri bo'ladimi? Viloyatlarga ham kadrlar, Toshkentga kadrlar kerakligiday zarur. Bollar borib, siz aytgande bir chekka sassiq burchagda yotishmidi, balki bilimlarini ishlatib ekonomikani rivojlantirishga kirishishadi (majori business bolsa, nu i certainly, o'ziga ishonsa). Viloyatlarda 'manufacturing business' uchun bo'lgan imkoniyatlar Toshkentinikga qaraganda qulayroq: 1. qishloq ho'jalik mollarini deyarli hammasi viloatlarda etishtiriladi; 2. ishsizlikdan suffer qilayotgan halq yahshi pul to'laydugan ishda ishlash uchun ertalabdan kechgacha ter-tokishga tayor. Toshkentda esa faqat bir office bolsa boldi, bag'i ketoradi. Vot toka uchiga chiqqan ablah official-lardan qutilib olsa bolgani. JV yoki chet el krediti tortilgan firmani ochilishini bilib (aha.., baks bor), ertasiga hammasi o'z "hizmatlarini" taklif qilish uchun keladi. Bunday hollar mavjud bo'lganligidan tuzukkina habarim bor. Oldin private sector da ishlaganimda anchasini ko'rganman.

Boshqa masalaga kelsak,
aytilgan sistemani hali beri o'zgartirish qiyin, nega? Chunki insofli, halol odamlar hokimiyatga chiqa ololmidi. U erga ko'tarilish uchun o'zidan oldingi, sovet pokoleniesining muzikasiga oynash kerak: kimgadir pora berish kerak, kimgadir nisbatan muttahamlik qilish kerak va hokazo... bu hammaga ma'lum bo'lsa kerak. Muammoni echimi hozirgi avlodga bog'liq. Bollar o'zlariga qattiq principlarni ishlab chiqarishsa, kelajagmiz ancha tuzuk bo'lishi anniq.

tschus

MegaZ

10-30-2001, 11:48 PM

This is so true and so f***ing sad :(

I am from Ferghana myself - during the last 5 years the only change I have seen there is a park in central Ferghana ! Everything else is the same, even worse :(

Ferghana's hokim is a complete moron - he ordered to buy a crapload of paint (probably to earn $$$) and painted most of the buildings (especially apartments) in pink, light green and yellow ! Can you imagine ? Those building's were covered with marble pieces (mramornaya kroshka) and they are painted now ! That's so f***ing ugly and shitty !

I have also heard that the same hokim sells high-rank positions in Ferghana valley (for $10,000 or more). Plus, he is replacing all leaders of Ferghana with his own guys, backing his ass up.

One other thing - his sons are drug traders/abusers. This fact is well-known even by the police/SNB whatever. And still, nobody is acting ! You know why ? Because his wife's somehow connected with the president (relatives) !

And you expect valleys to grow and develop with this kind of leadership ???

The thing that drives me totally nuts is that the president assigns a hokim to any region. WTF is that ? Because of this, Ferghana's hokims get replaced at least once a year :-( He does not know any details about a person - people do !
Hokims (mayors) should be chosen by the people, since they know who is who.

Eeee...voshem :-( It is very sad...and depressing

General'

10-31-2001, 05:37 AM

Salom "sure", ishla yahshimi? Kecha missed call qoldirgankansiz, bugun gpalsharmiz, off-peakda,ha ha.

Ho'sh, Bunsha, endi o'ylab javob qilibsiz. Men sizga aytsam, gaplarimda hech qanday ambitious narsa yo'q edi, "kambag'al viloyatlar" esa yarim istehzo bilan yozilgan. "Farg'onaga surushingiz mumkin" esa bu sizning Farg'ona shahrini salkam ideal qilib(gaz, issiq suz, benzin - hammasi muhayyo, jannata jannat)) ko'rsatganignizga javob edi. Endi o'zimga kelsak, men ham vodiydanman, aniqrog'i Namangandanman. Shuning uchun har bir gapimga hohlasam-hohlamasam viloyatlik ko'zi bilan qaraganman.

Menimcha orada hech qanday tushunarsiz bo'lgan narsa qolmadi.

E'tibotingiz uchun rahmat

underloaded_

10-31-2001, 09:05 AM

Da, MEGAZ, plohi dela.
Ya uje cht-to i v Tashkent uje ne hochu.

Cheers

OPTIMIST'

10-31-2001, 09:07 AM

Someone said the following:
Cute, viloyat hokimiyatini bir "sassiq" burchagiga borib, chirib yotish niyatim yoq va boshqalar ham viloyatlarga bunday "orzu" bilan qaytishmidi shekili. Albatta bu bollarni fikrida business bilan shug'ullanish bor. Endi hamma Toshkentda ko'tarilaman, yoki baks tolaydigan joyga kirib olaman deb ketaversa, viloyatlarda kim qoladi? Toshkentni rivojlantirib qoyish bilan viloyatlarga ta'siri bo'ladimi? Viloyatlarga ham kadrlar, Toshkentga kadrlar kerakligiday zarur. Bollar borib, siz aytgande bir chekka sassiq burchagda yotishmidi, balki bilimlarini ishlatib ekonomikani rivojlantirishga kirishishadi (majori business bolsa, nu i certainly, o'ziga ishonsa). Viloyatlarda 'manufacturing business' uchun bo'lgan imkoniyatlar Toshkentinikga qaraganda qulayroq: 1. qishloq ho'jalik mollarini deyarli hammasi viloatlarda etishtiriladi; 2. ishsizlikdan suffer qilayotgan halq yahshi pul to'laydugan ishda ishlash uchun ertalabdan kechgacha ter-tokishga tayor. Toshkentda esa faqat bir office bolsa boldi, bag'i ketoradi.

wow, namuncha oson kivoribsiz, manimcha siz oldin viloyatlarda bolmagansiz shekilli, niuchego, organib kolasiz,

OPTIMIST ;p

Akhee-Abdullah

10-31-2001, 01:26 PM

I think it would be wise if we stop thinkin' like soviets, "Kadrlar qishloqlarga ham borishi kerakku, Viloyatlarni ham ko'tarish kerakku"-what a BS. Every citizen of Uzbekistan has a right to choose the place of work, living. None has the right to "exile" any of the citizens to the farthest corner of the republic. If Tashkent is rich, let the people come to Tashkent, more competition amongst the people for a narrow margin expected income will create a dynamic atmosphere, ceteris paribus. I do not see anything wrong if any of the students stays in tashkent, 'cause economists believe that a human being is a rational economic agent (most of the time), so he'll work there where the PV of his expected future cash flows will be maximized.
Last Comment-Nima Umidchi Bulldozermidi Qishloqlarni botqoqdan chiqarib bergani!!!
Cheers, :)

Misha

10-31-2001, 02:29 PM

Lucky!
I am with you..
good job.. I fully support you...
good luck I mean, you `re lucky anyway, in case if you short of luck :)
joke ;p

Freestyler@

10-31-2001, 02:32 PM

You've been doing too much finance, <Lucky>... :)

But I do agree with you here...

underloaded_

10-31-2001, 02:43 PM

Mde... rech' vrode bi i ne shla o zasilke umidovcev na pod'em celinnnih zemel'. Govorilos' o bolee ravnomernom razvitii kak stolici, tak i sel'skih rayonov, podniatiya bitovih usloviy, udeleniya vnimanie sel'skomu hoziaystvu i industrii v provincii, likvidacii bezrabotici na sele.

Vsegda legche viskazivat' umnen'kie zamechaniya, chem chitat' chujie topiki i nahodit' racional'nie zerna v nem.

Cheers

underloaded_

10-31-2001, 03:18 PM

Kak umidovcem hotelos' bi realizovat' sebia v Uzbekistane, tak je te kto rodom iz oblastey hoteli bi realizovat' sebia v rodnoh mestah.

A esli sledovat' logike chto ne nado nichego meniat' i pust' vse edut tuda gde bol'she kesha, to nado bi vsem nam ostavat'sia v US :)

Devka

10-31-2001, 03:20 PM

v v US bili? i Uexali? how do you guys do that?

underloaded_

10-31-2001, 03:22 PM

Esli dolgo hotet', to kogda-nibud' poluchit'sia :)
A esli pri etom eshe i pitatsia, to poluchit'sia nemnogo ran'she.

devchenka

10-31-2001, 03:24 PM

i mean.ya uje v US 8 let.....prosot ya ne kgo eshe ne vstrechala kotorie syuda priejali s Uz i potom uejali......do you get like a student visa?

underloaded_

10-31-2001, 03:32 PM

yes, student visa first... h1b... green card, a domoy to vse ravno hochetsia :(

underloaded_

10-31-2001, 03:36 PM

8 let v US, eto ochen' dolgo, hotia cherez 8 let naverno uje i ne tianet.

Akhee-Abdullah

10-31-2001, 07:09 PM

Underloaded-Vsegda legche viskazivat' umnen'kie zamechaniya, chem chitat' chujie topiki i nahodit' racional'nie zerna v nem.

I hope you live up to what you written here ;)

Underloaded-Mde... rech' vrode bi i ne shla o zasilke umidovcev na pod'em celinnnih zemel'.

Podyom celinnih zemel=Govorilos' o bolee ravnomernom razvitii kak stolici, tak i sel'skih rayonov, podniatiya bitovih usloviy, udeleniya vnimanie sel'skomu hoziaystvu i industrii v provincii is the same shit.

-eto je lozung 60-70ix, LOL. A mne kajetsya chto mi jivyom na 21om veke a ne v proshlom veke, ne tak-li Underloaded? Pomoemu ti rodinu pokinul do razvala "Moguchego SSSR"a. Izvinyaus za to chto ya doljen prodoljat na Angliyskom(I know that my Russian sucks more than Freesyler's Uzbek sucks ^_^^_^^_^^_^)

Study economics and you gonna learn how an economic individual should learn to take care of himself in the free market economy. Dedushka Vasya, bolshe ne budet "prislat",iz Kremlya, gramotnuyu potchyotu s kommentariem: "za otvagu i uslugu", i bonusov bolshe ne budet kak eto bilo ranshe: ish Dekhkanin iz Surkhandarii otdixayet v Kislovodske.Samomu i ne veritsya chto eto bilo deystvitelno tak. Shas i tolko mechtay chto gosudarstvo dayot tebe kusok xleba bez vsyakikh pretenziy. Dude those times have passed, everybody should take care of himslef, that we call a capitalism.

In nutshell-we are not being educated in the USA,the UK, Germany, Canada and other countries in order to "pokhat" in the farthest districts of Uzbekistan. What would I do anyways there?? Stanu li ya kolxoznikom??? Xlopko sobirat budu chtoli??? Or would I share the "levak" with the "Rais" of Kolkhoz who paid at least $5,000 to get his "kreslo." What a "siyqasi chiqqan patriotism." I've never heard of any American or Western European yelling "We gotta send the intellectuals to the underdeveloped regions in order to develop those areas, or have you?!! If it is necessary and lucrative to do so people would go there without "exile", in other words Umidie does not have to be an "Uznik" in his own country, plus we do not have any written contract with Umid foundation which says that we need to go to the district that we come from, or do we?!! The urban areas is a place where intellectulas get together and lay foundation to the next generation. We ain't have planned economy or do we?!(We still have it, but as far as I know Capitalistic features of the free market should replace them.) Personally, I would not mind spending my 5 year "exile life" in Jasliq ;) as long as they provide me with internet connection,a satellite dish, a bathroom with hot and cold water, and a 45 loaves of bread a month and $100 salary ;)
Cheers, :)

Freestyler@

11-01-2001, 06:48 AM

Vobshem, ne nado tut osobo umnichat' a luchshe srazu priyti k ochevidnomu vivodu:

Nikto ne v prave kommandovat' gde komu jit' i rabotat'! - {Odin iz principov svobod lichnosti. Yesli ne oshibayus', ogovoryon i v nashey Konstitucii.}
S Umidovcami - osobiy sluchay, oni podpisali kontrakt, a znachit i vzyali na sebya opredelyonniye obyazatel'stva.

Visheskazannoye, odnako, ne menyayet fakta togo, chto i v samom dele raznica v razvitii mejdu centrom i periferiyey slishkom bol'shaya i nejelatel'naya. Poetomu pravitel'stvu sleduyet vesti chyotkuyu i reshitel'nuyu politiku po usrtaneniyu etogo fakta, no ne putyom "ssilok", kak eto delalos' pri SSSR, a putyom yestevstvennim pooshreniya - naprimer, cherez visokuyu zarplatu i horoshiye usloviya jizni dlya jelayushih rabotat' na blago razvitiya rayonov i syol...

=====================
"...Istina gde-to ryadom, istina gde-to tut!.."
=====================

underloaded_

11-01-2001, 09:08 AM

Really, Lucky, your russian sucks! :)

That's why you didn't get my simple words:

"rech' vrode bi i ne shla o zasilke umidovcev na pod'em celinnnih zemel' ",

which means: nobody is talking that umidies should be exploited.

I said because you sound insulted:
"Last Comment-Nima Umidchi Bulldozermidi Qishloqlarni botqoqdan chiqarib bergani!!! "

Tak prichem zdes' lozungi proshlogo veka?
"-eto je lozung 60-70ix, LOL." Did I mention that Umidies need to be sent to celina?

You really sound offended. Read your comments:
- Stanu li ya kolxoznikom???
-we do not have any written contract with Umid foundation which says that we need to go to the district that we come from, or do we?!!
Don't be afraid: nobody said that you should or would.

Hot' ti, Lucky, i vigliadish' kak paniker, kotoriy streliaet ne v popad vo vse storoni, no vot main point ti pochti ponial:
Personally, I would not mind spending my 5 year "exile life" in Jasliq as long as they provide me with internet connection,a satellite dish, a bathroom with hot and cold water, and a 45 loaves of bread a month and $100 salary.

Rech' ob etom i shla: nujno sozdat' elementarnie usloviya dlia razvitiya oblastey: poskol'ku osnovnaya chast' naseleniya projivaet v provincii.
Poka para soten intellektualov soberetsia v Tashkente i porodit budushee pokolenie, 20 millionov ludey miagko govoria okajutsia nedeesposobnimi. Vot togda i uvidim cenu nashemu intellektu.

Cheers

P.S.
kto i kogda i uehal, tebia kak to ne doljno kasatsia. Ne stoit vigliadet' isheykoy, potomu chto kak minimum eto nekrasivo, a kak maksimum mojet nam pridetsia kogda-nibud' rabotat' vmeste.

Akhee-Abdullah

11-01-2001, 09:59 AM

Lucky said-"Podyom celinnih zemel=Govorilos' o bolee ravnomernom razvitii kak stolici, tak isel'skih rayonov, podniatiya bitovih usloviy, udeleniya vnimanie sel'skomu hoziaystvu industrii v provincii"- is the same shit.

Whichever way you say it it is the same thing, I hope now you understood me ;)
Cheers, :)

underloaded_

11-01-2001, 10:11 AM

Shit is when one sends people to "celina" or "golodnaya step' ", where people do not live.

When you taking care of regions, where 20 mln people already live in poor condition, and do not have place to go, it is called "zabota o svoih grajdanah i narode". It is far from a shit in your understanding.

I hope now you see a difference.

Cheers

General'

11-01-2001, 10:54 AM

Lucky, whassup?
Ja Ekonomikani ko'p o'qivoribsiz, shekilli. Qaerda bo'lsa free market, free market.

1) Bu ideyaga hech kim shu paytgacha to'la to'kis amal qilmagan va O'zbekiston ham birdaniga o'tmoqchi emas, at least in coming 10 years. Real ko'z bilan qarang.

2) Men bir necha marta aytdim, gap bu yerda Umidchilarning Toshkenda qolishi haqida ketmayapti va hech kim ularni tanqid qilmayapti.

3) Keyin, menimcha, sizu bizdan so'rashmasa kerak qaerga ishga jo'natishni, agar empirically olib qarasak, uje Umid regional siyosatga o'tgan.(albatta 60-70yillar siyosati emas). Deyarli hamma viloyatliklar viloyatga jo'natilyapti, aytmoqchi, Umiddan o'tish imtihonidayam viloyatdan bo'lgan bolalarga , ya'ni bizga alohida o'tish balli (pastroq), Toshkentliklarga alohida bo'lgan, menimcha farq 20 ball edi.

3) Freesyler bilan Underloaded aytgan incentive ideyasi ham juda to'g'ri.

There is a huge difference between theory and practice

Bi o'ylab ko'ring yana

Akhee-Abdullah

11-01-2001, 11:33 AM

Not Much!!-General

Nimagadir man o'tgan yili, viloyatlar uchun alohida bal yoq edi :( , i.e. 1999. Besides that i do not think it is constitutional to deprive of some students from passing because they got lower score compared to their own region, like for example, I heard in 1998 many Tashkenti studnets could not pass despite the fact they had high scores. And some crapps from regions passed, who could not continue their education successfully, this is an irrational policy indeed. About sending students to regions: I know heck a lot guys who managed to stay in Tashkent, I hope, I am gonna be one of those, 'cause my job is waiting for me ;)
Cheers, :)

Cute1

11-01-2001, 02:00 PM

Yeah man, it's really unfair and stupid.
But it is true that 2000 umidies from tashkent had collect 50% more than students from region to pass the specialization test.
For example you had to take 150 out of 200 in test and oral exam to pass if you are from Tashkent, where 100 was the requirement for viloyat. This was for undergraduates. Many of my friends won the competition but didn't get the scholarships , simply because they couldn't get more than 150 (which is really difficult to get 75% from oral and test). students from viloyats who got much less but got more than 100 out of 200 passed instead of them. :(((

uzbek immigrant in USA

11-01-2001, 05:48 PM

General you ---> down ^_^

sheR

11-02-2001, 12:24 AM

hey!
there everybody?
are u sure u wanna u leave your your****ing body,but give everything u got ubabe!
so anybodybody who wants yo chrck some stuff here please responde to me!!!!!!

sheR

11-02-2001, 12:25 AM

Lucky (Nov 01, 2001 11:33):
Not Much!!-General

Nimagadir man o'tgan yili, viloyatlar uchun alohida bal yoq edi :( , i.e. 1999. Besides that i do not think it is constitutional to deprive of some students from passing because they got lower score compared to their own region, like for example, I heard in 1998 many Tashkenti studnets could not pass despite the fact they had high scores. And some crapps from regions passed, who could not continue their education successfully, this is an irrational policy indeed. About sending students to regions: I know heck a lot guys who managed to stay in Tashkent, I hope, I am gonna be one of those, 'cause my job is waiting for me ;)
Cheers, :)