CHECHNYA- BIZ SEN BILAN!

[Desperado]

Get bloody Russians out of your country!
Live as u wish!
Die as you wish!
Do not let strangers command you, You are on your own!
You are the real nation full of courage who is by all means entitled to freedom!
Abandon any words said by russians and on behalf of them who are in ally with them who are real suckers.
Doloy colonialist Russia!
Long live Chechen resistance!

a tak man na terrorist, na vovchikman ;)

[BOBOY]

QONGA QON JONGA JON

CHECHEN MUZAFFAR :snipersmile:

CHECHEN OG'ALARGA ZAFAR YOR BO'LSIN

[chukcha]

hmdaaa

[terrano]

QONGA QON JONGA JON

CHECHEN MUZAFFAR :snipersmile:

CHECHEN OG'ALARGA ZAFAR YOR BO'LSIN

Hech uylamagandim yoshlar orasidan shunchalik kuch topa oladiganlar topiladi deb gaplarni aytishga. Bu yahshi!!

Best regards !!!

I hope, with, dream, pray......
That two nations Chechens and Uygurs will finish two last Imperialistic-colonial regimes, Russain and Chinese......
I further hope that Tatars and Tibetians will also help!
)))

[NoLiMiT]

QONGA QON JONGA JON

CHECHEN MUZAFFAR :snipersmile:

CHECHEN OG'ALARGA ZAFAR YOR BO'LSIN


Man San Bilanman davay BoBoy davay URRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAA olg'a
urrrrrrrrrrrrrrraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[observer]

Assalom,

ya tut koe-cho podumal: vot govoryat, chto te kto prixodit v Chechnyu voevat (vyhodsi iz Middle East) eto nikto kak mejdunarodniye terroristy... davayte poprobuyem proanalizirovat i tu i etu storony.
1) zachem eti ludi (ne budu nikogo kleymit') prixodyat v Chechnyu i voyuyut protiv Rossii v litse yeyo soldat? (zamet'te, kto-by ni prisoedinyalsa k povstansam Chechni-vse musulmane) potomu chto u nix v serdsah gorit ogon' za bratyev-chechesev!.. potomu chto skazano: esli tvoy brat v Islame ne mojet sebya zashitit' ot obidchika, ty obyazatelno doljen poyti tuda i vzyat ruki orujiye i stoyat plecho-k-plechu... vot i idut v Chechnyu... tem bolee smert' muchenikov i obeshanniy Jannah (insholloh)za eto budet tolkat drugix ludey idti v Chechnyu...

2) Rossiya v svoyu ochered' ne hochet otdavat Chechne yeyo nezavisimost i suverinitet. da i ponyatno, esli ona poydot na etot shag, to "malen'kaya gordaya ptichka gor" oderjit sushestvennuyu pobedu nad Rossiyey. eto prosto koshmar naverno v mirovoy arene. potom naverno i ostalnye respubliki Rossii zahotyat otdelitsa.
2.1.) u Rossii, mne kajetsa, est esho i 2ya (sredi mnojestva ostalnyx) prichina: neft... vsyo prosto--a) na chechenskoy zemle est neft; b) cherez Chechnyu imeetsa dostup k Kaspiyu, gde "est mnogo-mnogo obezyan"... zdrasti, ya vash dyadya! eto je ponyatno!

(moy) vyvod: problema Chechni buit stoyat ostro poka Chechnya ne stanet "svobodnoy ptichkoy svobodnyx gor Kavkaza"

С точки зрения экономики и стабильности в том числе нашем регионе Чечня должна оставаться в России.

Эти дети гор никогда не будут жить мирно если за ними не следит большая сила . Да независимость Чечни может это звучит как-то справидливо - но это будет просто преступлением против всех находящихся поблизости от "Свободной Ичкерии" народов, да и самого народа, особенно мирной его части.
Эти дети гор хотят быть гордыми и так и получают по своей гордой физионамии грязным русским сопогом.
И не подумайте, что я за Россию - неизвестно кто больше нарушает права человека в Чечне русские или чеченцы. Просто вам повезло не иметь с чеченцами дело. Спросите у кого нибудь по старше в Казакстане (куда их репотрировал Сталин) про чеченцев они вам расскажут какие"трудолюбивые" и "честные" чеченцы. Их упертость только делает их народ меньше и уже многим становиться наплевать на "боцов за свободу" - потому что на западе всегда действуют из своих интересов. Американцам уже наплевать - осталось Европа. Во последнее время даже саудовцы, больше в поддержку Москвы потому что их отношения с Вашингтоном уходшаются с каждым днем -16 из 18 чел 11Сентября были саудовцами!

И не надо забывать что наша экономика очень зависит от стабильности экономики России - вследствии нахождения в одном государстве более 150 лет. Простой пример Август 1998г. наш независимый узбекский сум не продержался и недели после подения русского рубля. Россия остается крупнейшим торговым партнерам - надо все это помнить когда мы говорим о стабильности в России.

Наместе чеченцев я бы перестал злить Путина. Отсраивал чечню, наводил порядки - что бы ускорить вывод российских войск и т.д.

[Desperado]

Just some short notes on the post above by guest:

С точки зрения экономики и стабильности в том числе нашем регионе Чечня должна оставаться в России.

Эти дети гор никогда не будут жить мирно если за ними не следит большая сила... Эти дети гор хотят быть гордыми и так и получают по своей гордой физионамии грязным русским сопогом.
Guest, let me remind you from the beginning that you are talking about a whole nation with its own racial, national and religious and cultural identity. Therefore you shall not treat them offencively as 'children of mountains'. It sounds like you are talking about uneducated barbars. The statement above reveals your truly chauvinistic attitude against chechens, it is the same thing as once russians talked about uzbeks that they are lazy stupid sheeps, and without Russia uzbeks can not survive

И не подумайте, что я за Россию - неизвестно кто больше нарушает права человека в Чечне русские или чеченцы You have already unmasked yourslef, this was simply unnecessary you to say.

Просто вам повезло не иметь с чеченцами дело. Спросите у кого нибудь по старше в Казакстане (куда их репотрировал Сталин) про чеченцев они вам расскажут какие"трудолюбивые" и "честные" чеченцы. Их упертость только делает их народ меньше и уже многим становиться наплевать на "боцов за свободу" - потому что на западе всегда действуют из своих интересов. I still do not understand your vicious attitude towards a whole nation of chechens... I would understand you if you wrote 'some of them' or 'many of them' but your generalisation just tells us the level of your 'intelligence' and 'education'.
I beg your attention, I am not talking about if our guest is right or wrong, because when it is obvious that someone is wrong, it is just foolish to try to prove it, there is no need to prove.Американцам уже наплевать - осталось Европа Americans and Europeans do not give a shit to anything my friend, they do something only if there is an INTEREST for them. It is your naivity to think them as 'Great Savers of the world'.

И не надо забывать что наша экономика очень зависит от стабильности экономики России - вследствии нахождения в одном государстве более 150 лет. Простой пример Август 1998г. наш независимый узбекский сум не продержался и недели после подения русского рубля. Россия остается крупнейшим торговым партнерам - надо все это помнить когда мы говорим о стабильности в России. There are 2 types of politics my friend: 1. Dirty Politics. 2. Clean Politics, and also 2 types of politicians: dirty and clean. I dont doubt that you belong to the first types of this classification (though i am not saying that you are a politician). I hope very much that many readers of this posting support politics of honour. I am personally against to keep our economy on the track at the cost of dishonesty and blood of other opressed nations. I am sorry that I start to propose ridiculous statements following guest. Actually there is no worry about a huge damage to the economy of Uzbekistan because of the internal problems in Russia, Russia is not only our choice for economic cooperation, she is one of them among MANY. Truly we benefit from friendly coopration with Russia, however we will not STARVE without her.
Наместе чеченцев я бы перестал злить Путина. Отсраивал чечню, наводил порядки - что бы ускорить вывод российских войск и т.д. Have not we witnessed the terror in Chechnya even in the first months of Putin's Presidency? Was not it one of the harshest and vicious acts against chechns in the history of Russia?
Do not forget we have served colonial Russia more than 130 years. Our grandfathers and grandmothers were killed by them and terrorised all the time along, even till very recent years... We gave up and lost our many precious values be it cultural or religius... It is them who tried to make manqurts or zombies out of us... Do not think that I am provacating a national hateress, I am reminding you just some pages of our history.
We know, we can not help the oppressed nations under Russia, BUT CAN'T WE EVEN SYMPATHIZE THEM??

[Muslim Hater]

****ing muslim Chechnya scum.

[To muslim hater]

Long live chechen brothers! Narod Uzbekistana s toboy nezavisimaya CHECHNYA!
Otomstite za muchenika HATABA!
Muslim Hater: d5a72c19, we are coming for yoU!
Uigur brothers fight for your independence!

[Amir Hatab]

Amir Hatab, voin za nezavisimost' i svobodu. Mujahiddeen!

[MegaZ]

Honestly, I'm on neutral side. No matter what is going on in Chechnya, Chechens have no right to kill innocent people (the same thing concerns Russians). Remember what happened last year in Nord Ost (Moscow)? And before/after that?

Islam is supposed to be a religion of peace, not war. Fighting shoulder-to-shoulder with another Muslim...what now? You want to take over the world? In a conflict like Chechnya-Russia, it's hard to assess who's right and wrong. Don't forget that it's not just about defending the land. There were and still are a lot of mercenaries in Chechnya, who get paid for killing Russian soldiers.

And if you are so worried about your friends Chechens, why don't you go to Chechnya and fight with them? Go ahead and declare a holy war against Russia. Maybe that would help you by increasing your "spiritual" temper.

Do not forget we have served colonial Russia more than 130 years. Our grandfathers and grandmothers were killed by them and terrorised all the time along, even till very recent years...
Yeah yeah...you sound just like our government that keeps shitting about Russia everywhere possible. What you don't understand, is that everybody is sick of that. Grandfathers and grandmothers were killed and terrorized by Russians? Huh...never heard of that from my grandparents. In fact, they seem to give preference to Russian government instead. Want to call them "zombies" or "manqurts"? And how in the world did Russia terrorize us till "very recent years"? Did Russia take your grandparents piece of bread? In fact, there is more terrorism coming from the present government! Look at all those people in jails. How many people got arrested by just going to a mosque or growing a beard? How many innocent people were killed? Believe me, those guys would rather prefer a Russian government than an Uzbek government official up their ass. And please don't give me "we're still in transition" bullshit.

Americans and Europeans do not give a shit to anything my friend, they do something only if there is an INTEREST for them.
I totally agree with that! Is there a county that does give a shit? ;-) Makes me wonder...

There are 2 types of politics my friend: 1. Dirty Politics. 2. Clean Politics, and also 2 types of politicians: dirty and clean.
Wrong. There is only one type of politics - dirty. That's what politics are all about.

[Amir Khatab!]

More wonderfull pics of Khatab!

[amir Khatab!]

Amir (Commander) Khattab was a native of Saudi Arabia. His father is a Saudi. The family of Khattab belongs to one of the most ancient clans of Arabia. His mother is Turkish and a native of Turkey. Khattab has many relatives. Back home his family is respected and considered pretty wealthy. According to some information, Khattab has 8 brothers. When he was 15, his parents decided to send him to the United States to study. But the young man left the family and motivated his decision by the right to make his own choice and take part in Jihad, according to the Shari'ah. Even though his older brother was trying to talk him out of it, Khattab left for Afghanistan as a volunteer. For several years he was fighting against the troops of Soviet invaders. This is where he was wounded. After the Soviet troops withdrew, Khattab returned home. But soon after that he went back to Afghanistan to help Tajik and Uzbek refugees. As Khattab himself said, in December 1994 he found out about the war in the Caucasus from CNN reports. He knew nothing about Chechnya before that, except for the stories about Imam Shamil, who is buried in Medina. Khattab was telling that he made a decision to go to Chechnya after he saw on TV how Chechen Mujahideen were proclaiming «Allah Akbar!» (God is Great!). Khattab arrived to Chechnya with two of his companions in the spring of 1995, and had not left Chechnya ever since.

Khattab was an active participant of war operations against the troops of Russian invaders, starting March 1995 until March 2002. In 1996 on the order from President of CRI he was appointed as Chief of Military Training Center of Central Front of CRI Armed Forces. Khattab held the post of the Military Commander of Majlis al-Shura of the Mujahideen of Ichkeria and Dagestan. He was the Deputy of Shamil Basayev (Amir of Majlis al-Shura). Khattab was in command of the Islamic International Brigade. He was granted the highest awards of the Chechen State. Married to a Darginian woman, a native of the village of Karamakhi, Dagestan, and has two children.

hhyeh if chechnya gets idependence it will be as taliban style Afganistan

[MegaZ]

hhyeh if chechnya gets idependence it will be as taliban style Afganistan
Totally agree with you! And there will be no more need for Afghanistan to supply the world's high demand for drugs :-) "Окно в Европу" как говорится.

Anyway, Chechen's have the right for independence I think. Maybe there are some fanatic terrorists in Chechnya right now, but generally speaking, this nation wants independence.

yes but chechns must be strong enough not to allow international terrorists like hattab(hozir u olgan) to locate in chechnya.

[HattaB]

Thanks for warm words about me...I am gona return soon

[NGU]

Guest: c360571e, who told you that he was a terorist? Your russian mass media? So, what about plestinians and Iraqis? mr Bush also calls them terorists.
Remember my little friend, one who is terorist for some, is FREEDOM fighter for another.

yes HTTAB is terrorist

[HattaB]

yes HTTAB is terrorist

man...be careful when you judging someone you don't know

[NewsGuys]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/429700.stm

glupaya Logika ili neobasnovannya teorema,no jiznenniy fakt.

1-one can't become a chechen if he is not born as a chechen (reasons: blood-trasfer + ansectors).we are so as we are created.it is our fate.

2- one can't be born as a BOSMACHI in usbek:fighter,rebeller,occupier,bandit), but later he becomes a bosmachi (reasons: social enviroment + certain circumstances). we are not guilty,we are forced to be so.it is our fate

[Alouddin]

www.kavkazcenter.com

[mujreem]

Observer, atya tya tya tya.

S kakih eto por moderatori stali propagandirovat' odiozniye sayti.
A ved' tam mnogo chego mojno uvidet', i ne vsegda "polit-korrektnuyu".
I yesho, Observer, eto sayt wahabitov. Be careful.

wa'assalam

[Hiyt]

Observer, atya tya tya tya.

I yesho, Observer, eto sayt wahabitov. Be careful.

wa'assalam

Malenkiy namek na bolshoe obstoyatelstvo... Hahaha..
YOu be carefull my little friend.

Toje wasalam

[Alouddin]

mujreem, da ya, mlyah, chisto po teme :D btw, what about suwon-taegu route? any news?

[Akhee-Abdullah]

Observer, atya tya tya tya.

S kakih eto por moderatori stali propagandirovat' odiozniye sayti.
A ved' tam mnogo chego mojno uvidet', i ne vsegda "polit-korrektnuyu".
I yesho, Observer, eto sayt wahabitov. Be careful.

wa'assalam

Subhanallah :!: Did not you recognize your own Sufi brothers Mujreem :?: Since when, did you start to call your sufis with other nicks that you have learned from your deviated Sheikhs?This is a Sufi-Deobandi site, not a Salafee one. Kavkaz Centre is as deviated as you are and your other brothers like Nurchiler, Hizbut-Tahrir, Ikhwan, Hezbollah, Hamas, Al-Qaeeda, Jahmiyyah, Sufiyya, Tablighee, Shia, Rafidah, Khawarij, Murjia and Mujreemun (Literal meaning of Mujreem is a Polytheist,criminal, and sinner. Now wonder you name yourself with what you love to be called. A disguised piety, disguised under a hatred towards those who follow the Quraan and the Sunnah, not their own whims).

Here is the Kavkaz Cnetre http://www.kavkaz.org.uk/links/index.php?lang=rus Now point out to me a single link that they are affiliating themselves with and it is a Salafee one. But what you find is sufee sites, not just ONE, more than one.

May Allah swt belittle and curse the one who belittle His lofty name Al-Wahhab (The All Giver). If you wanna know the site of the Ahli Sunnah Wal Jamaa , then go the authentic sources. There are not many contrary to what you think. You can find all of them at www.salaf.com


BTW, Saudi King and others were against the war crimes in Chechnya committed by Russian Federation and as well as Chechen rebels as opposed to Kabbani who supported Chechen rebels and Russian Sufi Mufti who supported the Russian Federation.


MegaZ and others- The war in Chechnya has many different angles. It is absolutely unjust to force Chechens to stay within the Russian Federation and massacre and discriminate chechens whenever there is an opprtunity to hide it.

At the same time it is against Islamic Teachings to Force people into Islaam, slay inncoent people, terrorize civilians and committing suicide, and terrorist attacks. It can not be justified at all. Those crimes have no grounds within Sharia.

Many have declared wars in the name of Christ, Communism, Nazism, Islaam and etc. However, only Islaam gets the blame for crimes of the few Muslims. While others are never mentioned. I am not here to defend Muslims but Islaam, though Islaam does not need to be defended. Its injunctions are clear and pure, and not against the inborn nature of mankind.

Bin Laden is a Muslim, Khattab was a Muslim, Namangani was a Muslim (wallahu alam again) But they are not ISLAM. If you wanna know the stance of Islaam towards Hijacking, terrorism and other crimes visit www.fatwa-online.com Only after knowing the truth, you will isnahllah realize that few are using the Islamic Cause for their own crooked advantages.

[G]

Hey o'zi sunniylar bormi bu forumda?

Aka Lucky siz qaysi mazhabdasiz. Man Hanafiyaman. Sizchi? Agar boshqasida bo'sez tushintirib bera olasizmi farqini va nimaga o'sha mazhabda (oqimda) ekanligingizni. Iltimos har hil copy&paste siz. Chunki yuqoridagi postiz ancha yahshi yozilgan

Hey o'zi sunniylar bormi bu forumda?

Aka Lucky siz qaysi mazhabdasiz. Man Hanafiyaman. Sizchi? Agar boshqasida bo'sez tushintirib bera olasizmi farqini va nimaga o'sha mazhabda (oqimda) ekanligingizni. Iltimos har hil copy&paste siz. Chunki yuqoridagi postiz ancha yahshi yozilgan

Gomer-Assalam alaikum wa rahmatullah,

Sawollar wa "ta'riflar" uchun rahmat :arrow: Ammo sawolizga jawob berishdan oldin, bir tushunmovchilikka azgina aniqlik Kirgizmoqchiman. Akhee-Abdullah mani yengi "Nick" im. AKA degani Aka emas balki "As well As Known" deganidir. Qadrli forum ishtirokchilari, Lucky bilan Akhee-Abdullah bir kishi ekanligini ma'lum etish uchun etilgan ishdir bu.

Gomer-xop kelishdik, copy & paste qilish youq, ammo mani uzundan uzun yozganlarimni sizam bosh tortmay oqishingiz shart bolib qoldida endi : )

Madhab masalasidagi sawolingizga jawobim, men Fiqh masalalarida Imam Aboo Haneefaga hamda Ahli Sunnah wal Jamaoning mashhur imomlari, Imam Shafee, Imam Maleek ibn Anas wa Imam Ahmad Bin Hanbal usullaridan foydalanaman. Imam Aboo Haneefaning Imomi Muhammad salallahu alayhiwassalam bolgan ekan, Imam Aboo Haneefaning izdoshlari ham Imam Aboo Haneefaga ushbu masalada ergashsalar tog'riroq boladi.

Sawolingizga londa qilib jawob qilganda, Imam Aboo Haneefaning izdoshlaridan biri bolishga harakat qilaman. Zora tort Imamning har biri ittiba etishga loyiq zotlardir.

Avvalambor, har bir Muslim(a) oz oldiga Allahning Kitobi wa Rasool salallahu alayhiwassalamning sunnatiga ergashishlikni bosh maqsad etib olishi shart. Haqiqiy sof Islam wa Iyman haqiqati shudir. Hich bir iymonli kishi Allah wa uning Rasooli salallahu alayhiwassalamdan kelgan narsaga ergashishlikdan boyin tovlamaydi, balkim ularga ergashishlikda doim harakatda boladi. Allah swt aytganidek:

Ahli Iymonlar Allah wa Uning Rasooli sallallaahu alayhi wa sallamga ozaro hukm chiqarishda chaqirilganlarida shunday dedyidlar: Biz eshitamiz wa boysunamiz. Ana oshalar muvaffaqqiyatlilardir. [Soorah an-Noor 24:51].

Wa Allaah taolo munofiqlar haeeda:

Wa ularga : "Kelinglar Allah nozil etgan wa Uning Rasooli olib kelganlar bilan hukm etaylik;" deyilganda, siz munofiqlarni yuzlarini hazar bilan burishtirganining guvohi bolasiz. [Soorah an-Nisaa 4:61].


Demak Kitab wa Sunnatgagina ergashishlik lozim ekan, wa faqat oshagina har bir Muslim(a) ning fundamental maqsadi bolib qolishi kerak, faqat ushbu yolgina Ahli Sunnah wal Jamaatning yolidir. Ammo, insonlar jismoniy wa aqliy jihatdan bir xil emaslar. Bazilar, qiyin masalani tez tushunadigan bolishsalar, bazilarga oddiy masalani tushuntirish soatlab waqt oladi. Xuddi, bazilarning matematikadan qobiliyati, wa otkirligini korib hayratlansangiz, bazilarning 2ning kubini bilmasligidan afsuslanmaysiz, balkim qobiliyati youq ekan deb qoya qolarsiz. Din masalasida ham shunga oqshash. Bazilar Quronning wa hadeesning matnini oqib tushunib, ulardan din ahkomlarini hosil eta olishsa, bazilar oshaning 180 daraja teskarisidir.

Wa kishilarning, bazilari ichida olim wa ulamolari bordirki, ular Quron wa Sunnatni ota chuqur biladilar, Arab tilini mukammal egallaganlar, wa din ahkomlarini tushuna oladilar, hamda Quron wa Sunnatdan qonunlar hosila eta oladilar. (Abu Haneefah, Imam Malik, Imam Shafee, Imam Ahmad, Imam Bukahriy, Tirmidhiy, Nasai, Imam Dawud, Ibn Taymiya, Ibn Qayyum, Al-Albani, Shanqeeti, Bin Baaz, Uthaymin wa minglab boshqa ulamolar oshalar qatoridalar)

Wa bazi birowlar esa ushbu ikki qarama qarshi qutbning ortasidadirlar. Bu toifa kishilar birinchi toifa kabi Johil bolmasalarda dinning mukammal fan wa shaxobchalarini bilishmaydi, wa diniy ahkomlarni hulosa etisholmaydilar. Ammo din masalasida ota yaxhsi tushunchasi bor kishilardir. Demak kishilar Islom dinini bilish darajasida asosan 3 toifaga bolinarkan wa osha uch guruhning ichida ham tabaqalar mavjud.

Birinchi toifa kishilar Muqallidun (taqlid qiluvchilar), Ikkunchi toifa Mujtahidun (ijtihad qiluvchilar) wa Uchunchi toifa Muttaibun (ergashuvchilar) deb ataladilar.

Birinchi toifa kishlar Ahli Sunnah Wal Jamaaning hohlagan tort Imomlaridan biriga taqlid etishlari lozimdir.

Ikkinchi toifa kishlari Quron wa Sunnatda buyurulgan ahkomlarga togridan togri ergashadilar wa hich bir madhabni taqleed etmaydilar (albatta ushbuga 10-20 yillab Oliy dargohlarda oqib, zakovatli usotdalr qolida ta'lim olib erishiladi). Masalan, Imam Aboo Haneefaning yoki Imam Bukhariyning madhablari bolmagan. Imam Aboo Haneefa "Hanafiya" degan madhabni eshitmasdan wa bilmasadan olib ketganlar. Wa na bironta Sahoba yoki Tobeenning madhabi bolgan. Ushbu toifadagi kishilar kishlarni togri haq yolga boshlaydilar. Ijtihad ahliga biron bir mazhabga taqleed yoki ittiba etishlik mumkin emas. (bazi kichik masalalarni etiborga olmaganda)


Uchunch toifaga kishilarga esa taqleed wa Ijtihad mumkin emas. Bu kishilar oq wa qorani ajrata oladigan, Arab tilini biluvchi yoki organyotgan wa Din ahkomlarini mustaqil oqib tushuna oladiganlardir, hamda baholi qudrat amal etuvchilardir.

Kimdakim na ijtihad wa na ittiba qila olmasa demak unga taqleed vojib wa lozimdir. Ushbuning dalili esa Islomning fundamental qoidasida mujassamdir, yani "Qurbi yetgan Quron wa Sunnatgagina ergashishishi shartidir." Allah swt etganidek:

Allah swt sizga nozil etgan narsagagina Ittiba eting. Undan ozga dostlaringiz wa himoyachilaringizga ittiba etmangiz. [Soorah al-Araaf 7:3].

Allahning Rasooli bergan har narsani oling, wa Allahning rasooli nekidan qaytarsa, oshandan tiyiling [Soorah al-Hashr 59:9].

Xulosa Agar kimdakim Quron wa Hadislarni mustaqil oqib, tushunib bilolsayu ammo din ahkomlarini hosila eta olishga qobil bolmasa, u Muttaib darajasiga tushadi. Agar, ushbuni ham uddalay olmasa, kishi Muqallid darajasiga tushadi, u kishiga Ahli Sunnah wa Jamaning 4 madhabdan biriga taqlid qilish lozim bolib qoladi..


Gomer-masalaga jittagina bolsada aniqlik kirita oldimmi :?:

Forum ishtirokchilari-Apologize for going off topic and posting religious material in this board.

[G]

Akhee Abdullah

Agar sizi to'g'ri tushungan bo'lsam siz Muqallidun massiz. Balkim Muttaibunsiz to'g'rimi?

Lekin ba'zi forum ishtrokchilari sizni Vohobiylikda ayblashmoqda bunga qanday qaraysiz?

[mujreem]

Assalamu Alaikum
Gomer, on tebe pudrit mozgi, prosto znayet chto ti malo ponimayesh (bez obid tol'ko) v voprosah religii, i manipuliruyet krasivimi slovami. No po poryadku.
Madhab masalasidagi sawolingizga jawobim, men Fiqh masalalarida Imam Aboo Haneefaga hamda Ahli Sunnah wal Jamaoning mashhur imomlari, Imam Shafee, Imam Maleek ibn Anas wa Imam Ahmad Bin Hanbal usullaridan foydalanaman.Obrati vnimaniye chto on ne govorit chto on podchinyayetsya kakomu libo konkretnomu imamu, a vsego lish' pol'zuyetsya ih metodami.

Imam Aboo Haneefaning Imomi Muhammad salallahu alayhiwassalam bolgan ekan, Imam Aboo Haneefaning izdoshlari ham Imam Aboo Haneefaga ushbu masalada ergashsalar tog'riroq boladi.Opyat' vchitivaysya v slova, govorit chto te kto idet po stopam imama Abu Hanifi budet luchshe yesli oni poydut po yego stopam. Ameriku otkril :)

Sawolingizga londa qilib jawob qilganda, Imam Aboo Haneefaning izdoshlaridan biri bolishga harakat qilaman. Zora tort Imamning har biri ittiba etishga loyiq zotlardir.Opyat' vchitivaysya, on ne govorit chto podchinyayetsya komu libo konkretno, a vsego lish starayetsya, no tut je podcherkivayet chto i drugiye dostoyni togo chto bi idti po ih stopam.

Dal'she on uje nachnet oprovergat' togo chto tut govoril, no opyat' je taktichno, nachnem analizirovat' po poryadku.
Avvalambor, har bir Muslim(a) oz oldiga Allahning Kitobi wa Rasool salallahu alayhiwassalamning sunnatiga ergashishlikni bosh maqsad etib olishi shart. Haqiqiy sof Islam wa Iyman haqiqati shudir. Zvuchit logichno, no etim taktichno obyasnyayetsya chto glavnaya cel' ne imami velikih madhabov, a pervoistochniki. Opyat' je zvuchit logichno, no eto adresovano imenno tem kto ne vedayet ob islame. Etimi krasivimi slovami vot uje na protyajenii vekov obmanivayutsya molodiye neveduyushiye lyudi. (Nu eto uje otdel'naya celaya tema, pozje obyasnyu) Posmotrim chto on dal'she govorit.
Hich bir iymonli kishi Allah wa uning Rasooli salallahu alayhiwassalamdan kelgan narsaga ergashishlikdan boyin tovlamaydi, balkim ularga ergashishlikda doim harakatda boladi. Allah swt aytganidek:

Ahli Iymonlar Allah wa Uning Rasooli sallallaahu alayhi wa sallamga ozaro hukm chiqarishda chaqirilganlarida shunday dedyidlar: Biz eshitamiz wa boysunamiz. Ana oshalar muvaffaqqiyatlilardir. [Soorah an-Noor 24:51].

Wa Allaah taolo munofiqlar haeeda:

Wa ularga : "Kelinglar Allah nozil etgan wa Uning Rasooli olib kelganlar bilan hukm etaylik;" deyilganda, siz munofiqlarni yuzlarini hazar bilan burishtirganining guvohi bolasiz. [Soorah an-Nisaa 4:61].Nu tut obshiye citati, menya bol'she interesuyet kakoy on vivod sdelayet iz vsego etogo.
Demak Kitab wa Sunnatgagina ergashishlik lozim ekan, wa faqat oshagina har bir Muslim(a) ning fundamental maqsadi bolib qolishi kerak, faqat ushbu yolgina Ahli Sunnah wal Jamaatning yolidir.Vot ono, tut uje pryama govorit chto podchinyatsya nujno ne imamam a pervoistochnikam. T.e. oproverjeniye togo chto on do sih por govoril, hotya tochnee on i shel k etomu.
Ammo, insonlar jismoniy wa aqliy jihatdan bir xil emaslar. Bazilar, qiyin masalani tez tushunadigan bolishsalar, bazilarga oddiy masalani tushuntirish soatlab waqt oladi. Xuddi, bazilarning matematikadan qobiliyati, wa otkirligini korib hayratlansangiz, bazilarning 2ning kubini bilmasligidan afsuslanmaysiz, balkim qobiliyati youq ekan deb qoya qolarsiz. Opyat' dolgoye vstupleniye, znachit seychas budet nechto bol'shoye.
Din masalasida ham shunga oqshash. Bazilar Quronning wa hadeesning matnini oqib tushunib, ulardan din ahkomlarini hosil eta olishsa, bazilar oshaning 180 daraja teskarisidir. Oppa, poluchili, vot ono. Zvuchit opyat' taki logichno ne tak li, no kak bi ne tak. Yedinstvenniy chelovek kotoriy 100% ponyal znacheniye Korana bil prorok Muhammad a.s.w. Chelovek ne sposoben ponimat' Koran, potomu chto eto slova Allaha, Koran mogut ponimat' tol'ko lyudi ucheniye, tol'ko te kogo sam Allah pojelayet chtobi oni ponimali. Potomu chto Koran eto ne chelovecheskoye tvoreniye, eto bojestvennoye slovo. Koran eto ne tvoreniye, eto slovo boj'ye. Lyuboy kto skajet chto on ponimayet Koran, on uje na nevernom puti. Koran mogut ponyat' tol'ko mujtahidi, a ih pal'cem sochitat', a na segodnyashniy den' net ni odnogo krupnogo uchenogo kotorogo mojno bilo bi nazvat' Mujtahidom. Nu chto to menya tut poneslo, dal'she posmotrim chto on govorit, tam uj prodoljim.

Wa kishilarning, bazilari ichida olim wa ulamolari bordirki, ular Quron wa Sunnatni ota chuqur biladilar, Arab tilini mukammal egallaganlar, wa din ahkomlarini tushuna oladilar, hamda Quron wa Sunnatdan qonunlar hosila eta oladilar.Smotri, on opyat' ogranichivayet vse chelovecheskimi vozmojnostyami, on ne govorit chto tol'ko lyudi ot samogo boga sposobni na eto, etimi slovami on hochet skazat' chto prakticheski lyuboy smojet sam ponyat' vse. Naprimer po tomu chto on tut opisal, chto je poluchayetsya, chem je togda huje ucheniye vostokovedi nineshnih nashih uchenih teologov? Poluchayetsya chto znat' chego to uje dostatochno dlya togo chtobi delat' vivodi, kak bi ne tak.
(Abu Haneefah, Imam Malik, Imam Shafee, Imam Ahmad, Imam Bukahriy, Tirmidhiy, Nasai, Imam Dawud, Ibn Taymiya, Ibn Qayyum, Al-Albani, Shanqeeti, Bin Baaz, Uthaymin wa minglab boshqa ulamolar oshalar qatoridalar)A tut uje on sovsem obnaglel, postavil kyafirov na odin ryad s uchenimi mujami islamskoy istorii.

Wa bazi birowlar esa ushbu ikki qarama qarshi qutbning ortasidadirlar. Bu toifa kishilar birinchi toifa kabi Johil bolmasalarda dinning mukammal fan wa shaxobchalarini bilishmaydi, wa diniy ahkomlarni hulosa etisholmaydilar. Ammo din masalasida ota yaxhsi tushunchasi bor kishilardir. Demak kishilar Islom dinini bilish darajasida asosan 3 toifaga bolinarkan wa osha uch guruhning ichida ham tabaqalar mavjud.

Birinchi toifa kishilar Muqallidun (taqlid qiluvchilar), Ikkunchi toifa Mujtahidun (ijtihad qiluvchilar) wa Uchunchi toifa Muttaibun (ergashuvchilar) deb ataladilar.V principe verno, no posmotrim k chemu on eto skazal.

Birinchi toifa kishlar Ahli Sunnah Wal Jamaaning hohlagan tort Imomlaridan biriga taqlid etishlari lozimdir.ne lozim, a farz.

Ikkinchi toifa kishlari Quron wa Sunnatda buyurulgan ahkomlarga togridan togri ergashadilar wa hich bir madhabni taqleed etmaydilar (albatta ushbuga 10-20 yillab Oliy dargohlarda oqib, zakovatli usotdalr qolida ta'lim olib erishiladi). Masalan, Imam Aboo Haneefaning yoki Imam Bukhariyning madhablari bolmagan. Imam Aboo Haneefa "Hanafiya" degan madhabni eshitmasdan wa bilmasadan olib ketganlar. Wa na bironta Sahoba yoki Tobeenning madhabi bolgan. Ushbu toifadagi kishilar kishlarni togri haq yolga boshlaydilar. Ijtihad ahliga biron bir mazhabga taqleed yoki ittiba etishlik mumkin emas. (bazi kichik masalalarni etiborga olmaganda)Opyat' pravil'no, no tut srazu je nado skazat' sleduyushee, chto posle etih samih velikih uchenih na svete ne bilo lyudey etogo urovnya. Ne posilal gospod' bol'she lyudey takogo visokogo ranga. Potomu chto ne bilo tomu neobhodimosti, vse uje bilo sistematizirovano i vse bilo postavleno chetko na svoyu nogu. Vse velikiye ucheniye kotoriye prihodili pozje, krutilis' vokrug etih 4 velikih uchenih.


Uchunch toifaga kishilarga esa taqleed wa Ijtihad mumkin emas. Bu kishilar oq wa qorani ajrata oladigan, Arab tilini biluvchi yoki organyotgan wa Din ahkomlarini mustaqil oqib tushuna oladiganlardir, hamda baholi qudrat amal etuvchilardir.Ne verno, verno odno chto im nel'zya delat' ijtihad, no idti po stopam velikih uchenih im obyazatel'no nado.

Kimdakim na ijtihad wa na ittiba qila olmasa demak unga taqleed vojib wa lozimdir.Farzdir.
Ushbuning dalili esa Islomning fundamental qoidasida mujassamdir, yani "Qurbi yetgan Quron wa Sunnatgagina ergashishishi shartidir."Eto misl' ne yavlyayetysa logicheskim prodoljeniyem togo chto bilo skazano tol'ko chto. On govorit chto te kto ne sposoben samostoyatel'no delat' vivodi obyazan podchinyatsya uchenim, i dal'she govorit, dokazatel'stvom tomu yavlyayetsya fundament islama, t.e. te kto sposoben doljen podchinyatsya pervoistochnikam. Tut sploshnaya manipulyaciya, potomu chto on prepodnosit veshi sovsem naooborot, na samom dele vse naooborot. Obyasnyayu.
Islam glasit chto te kto ne sposoben delat' vivodi samostoyatel'no, obyazan podchinyatsya uchenim, no eto ne znachit chto te kto sposoben ne doljen im podchinyatsya. Im doljni podchinyatsya vse. I te kto sposoben, i te kto ne sposoben.

Allah swt etganidek:

Allah swt sizga nozil etgan narsagagina Ittiba eting. Undan ozga dostlaringiz wa himoyachilaringizga ittiba etmangiz. [Soorah al-Araaf 7:3].Verno, no chto je etim govoritsya? Ne hochet li etim skazat' Lucky chto madhabi eto ne to chto bilo poslano Allahom? Yesli schitat' chto madhabi eto ne ot Allaha, to poluchayetsya musul'mane na protyajenii vekov otoshli ot islama. Do prihoda samogo abd al' Wahhaba, poluchayetsya musul'mane ne onimali etogo. No a yesli schitat' chto madhabi toje ot samogo Allaha? Togda poluchayetsya chto Lucky ooshibayetsya. A vse delo v tom chto oni ne hotyat priznavat' bojestvenniy faktor madhabov. Oni govoryat chto eto produkt chelovecheskogo geniya, oni ne priznayut chto eti velikiye ucheniye bili poslani Allahom, i chto oni ne radi sobstvennogo udovol'stviya delali vsyu etu tyajkuyu rabotu. Na to bila volya Allaha j.j.

Allahning Rasooli bergan har narsani oling, wa Allahning rasooli nekidan qaytarsa, oshandan tiyiling [Soorah al-Hashr 59:9].I eto verno, no ved' govoril je prorok chto nam nujno podchinyatsya uchenim, ved' on nam etogo ne zapeshal, a naooborot govoril chto bi mi delali imenno eto. I on proklinal teh kto samovol'no ne stanut podchinyatsya uchenim.

Xulosa Agar kimdakim Quron wa Hadislarni mustaqil oqib, tushunib bilolsayu ammo din ahkomlarini hosila eta olishga qobil bolmasa, u Muttaib darajasiga tushadi. Agar, ushbuni ham uddalay olmasa, kishi Muqallid darajasiga tushadi, u kishiga Ahli Sunnah wa Jamaning 4 madhabdan biriga taqlid qilish lozim bolib qoladi..Izobretayem velosiped!

Gomer, voprosi budut obrashaysya.

wa'assalam
P.S. etu temu dumayu mojno uje peremestit v razdel "Religiya i Kul'tura"

[anatoliydaev]

mujreem,

респект

mujreem,

Esli chestno ya hotel prochitat tvoy post ne poslednemu a predposlednemu postingu AKA Lucky gde on tebya obvinyayet v polytheizme.

(Literal meaning of Mujreem is a Polytheist,criminal, and sinner. Now wonder you name yourself with what you love to be called. A disguised piety, disguised under a hatred towards those who follow the Quraan and the Sunnah, not their own whims).


A naschet krassivih slov to samoe glavnoe on perestal cut&pasteom zanimatsya i teper vstupaet v diskussiyu i uje stanovitsya bolee interesnim chitat posti ne tolko ego a vseh voobshe.

Anatoliydaev prosto ochen hochetsya uznat ti musulmanin? Esli net pochemu respect?

[G]

sorry that was me.

[chen pen LI]

Interesnaya discusiya, no tolko vot uzbekskiy u menya slabovat, ne vihodit za ramki ulechnoy rechi...a tak intertesno interesno...

Akhee Abdullah

Agar sizi to'g'ri tushungan bo'lsam siz Muqallidun massiz. Balkim Muttaibunsiz to'g'rimi?

Lekin ba'zi forum ishtrokchilari sizni Vohobiylikda ayblashmoqda bunga qanday qaraysiz?
Gadoni dushmani gado boladi deganlar. Sen bularni bahsiga burningni sukmagin ukam, bilganini kilsin ikkalasi ham. Sen agar Allhni marhamatini kozonmikchi bolsang, namoz oki, roza tut, kolingdan kelsa zakot bet, hajga bor, odamlarga yahshilik kil, savob ishlar kil, hushmuomala bolgin, zaifalarni hurmat va izzat kilgin, ota-onangni rozi kilgin. Oddiy bir inson uchun shularning ozi ham yetadi. Bu miyasi govlab ketgan igvogarlar bilan tortishmoging hech bir hayrlik ish keltirmaydi.

Birinchi masala - Gomer- Mani bori yog'i etganim (Literal meaning of Mujreem is a Polytheist,criminal, and sinner. Now wonder you name yourself with what you love to be called. A disguised piety, disguised under a hatred towards those who follow the Quraan and the Sunnah, not their own whims), uni ahli sunnah wal jamaaning shaniga mazg'avag'a tokayotganligidan boshqa hich narsada ayblamadim.

Ikkinchi masala- Men muqallid man, Imam Aboo Haneefaga ergashaman fiqh masalalarida. Postimda londa qilib etganidim buni oldinroq. Lozim topsangiz yana aytaman, Sunniyman wa Hanafiyman. Ammo Johil emasman.

Uchinchi masala-kim dalilsiz wa kim dalil bilan gapiriyatgani ma'lum wa aniqku :!: Iymoni wa farosati bor inson, Quron wa Sunnat daliliga ergashadi, asossiz kalomga emas.

Tortinchi masala - Allah swt dinini Muhammad salallahu alayhi wassalam tiriklik paytida komil etgan, zero faqat Muhammad salallahu alayhiwassalam wahiy olar edi Allahdan boshqalar emas. Shunday ekan, Dinimiz komil bolgan unga hech bir qoshimcha kerak emas.

Beshinchi masala- Chindanda Fuqaho wa ulamolar, Muhammad salallahu alayhi wassalamning vorislaridirlar. Xususan, nomi etib otilgan tort imomlar. Ular Islam diniga hich qanaqa bid'a keltirmaganlar, Allah swt ulardan rozi bolsin. Ular Faqatgina Allahning Rasooli salallahu alayhiwassalam wa uning ummatiga bergan dinini bida't wa khurofotdan mohofadha etganlar, wa Islam dinini kishilarga organish onson bolishi wa tushntirish uchun Fiqh kitobi holida meros qoldirganlar.

[Akhee-Abdullah]

Akhee Abdullah

Agar sizi to'g'ri tushungan bo'lsam siz Muqallidun massiz. Balkim Muttaibunsiz to'g'rimi?

Lekin ba'zi forum ishtrokchilari sizni Vohobiylikda ayblashmoqda bunga qanday qaraysiz?
Gadoni dushmani gado boladi deganlar. Sen bularni bahsiga burningni sukmagin ukam, bilganini kilsin ikkalasi ham. Sen agar Allhni marhamatini kozonmikchi bolsang, namoz oki, roza tut, kolingdan kelsa zakot bet, hajga bor, odamlarga yahshilik kil, savob ishlar kil, hushmuomala bolgin, zaifalarni hurmat va izzat kilgin, ota-onangni rozi kilgin. Oddiy bir inson uchun shularning ozi ham yetadi. Bu miyasi govlab ketgan igvogarlar bilan tortishmoging hech bir hayrlik ish keltirmaydi.


Qadrlik birodarim Assalam alaikum wa rahmatullah.

Allah ajringizni bersin. Naseehatingiz uchun katta rahmat, wa juda togir nasihat beribsiz. Umid qilgandim xolos, ba'zilarga haq wa botilni baholi qudrat tushuntirshni. Oylvdimki, ularga haqiqat kerak deb, balki ularga haq emas botil wa bahs kerak ekan.

On the Permissibility and Conditions of Following a Madhab a Sunne view
http://www.forum.uz/viewtopic.php?t=14865&highlight=madhab


The Deen is complete:

Allaah says, "this day have I perfected your religion for you, completed my favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islaam as your religion" (5:4)

This verse embodies a clear statement that the religion has been completed and so has no need of addition and deletion, and our noble Messenger (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "there is nothing that Allaah ordered you with except that I have ordered you with it, and there is nothing that Allaah forbade you from except that I have forbidden you from it" (al-Bayhaqee and others)

And he (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "there is nothing that will take you closer to paradise but that I have enjoined it upon you, and there is nothing that will take you closer to hell but that I have warned you from it" (Musnad ash-Shaafi’ee and others).

So the Prophet Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) fulfilled the trust placed upon him by Allaah completely, explaining the religion to the people in it’s inward and outward form, making clear the lawful from the prohibited, the encouraged from the discouraged, even to the extent that he taught us the manners of going to the toilet, the manners of having sex with our partners etc.

Allaah says in His Book, "and We have revealed to you a Book explaining everything" (16:89), and He says, "We have neglected nothing in the Book" (6:37).

So in the Qur’aan is explained the principles of the religion, tawheed in all it’s various categories, even to the extent that it teaches us the manners of sitting in circles, visiting other peoples houses, the correct clothing etc. …

The Importance of Sticking to the Sunnah:

Allaah says, "indeed you have in the Messenger of Allaah an excellent example for the one who hopes in Allaah and looks to the Last Day." (33:21), He also says, "so if you obey him (i.e. Muhammad), then you will be guided" (25:54)

The Messenger of Allaah said, "I have left behind me two things, if you cling to them you will never go astray. They are the Book of Allaah and my Sunnah" (al-Haakim)

And he (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) also said, "…and you will live to see great difference, so cling to my sunnah and the sunnah of the rightly guided caliphs after me, even if it be with your teeth" (Bukhaaree)

The Taabi’ee, the Imaam, az-Zuhree commented, "clinging to the sunnah is to be saved, as Imaam Maalik said, ‘like the Ark of Noah’, he who embarked upon it was saved, and he who did not was destroyed." (ad-Daarimee)

In these narrations is clear evidence that the way of salvation and safety is to closely follow the Sunnah of our Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam), and not to deviate from his path, not accepting the guidance of another individual, nor accepting a corrupted form of the Sunnah. Allaah says, "and whosoever contends with the Messenger after guidance has been made clear to him, and follows a way other than the way of the believers, We shall leave in the path he has chosen, and land him in Hell, what an evil destination!"



The Sunnah shall become corrupted:

We are taught in the revelation that the Sunnah shall become corrupted and this corruption would become the norm, so much so that the people who follow the Sunnah would become as strangers, and those that call to purifying the sunnah would be slandered and reviled. The Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "Islaam began as something strange, and it shall return as something strange as it began. So Tooba (a tree in paradise) to the strangers." It was asked, "who are the strangers?" He replied, "those that purify and correct what the people have corrupted of my sunnah" (Tabaraanee in al-Kabeer [6/202])

And what is this corruption, it is none other than innovation, introducing into the pure religion of Allaah new ways of worshipping Him that He has not taught, blemishing His religion with our whims and desires, something that Allaah Himself condemns, "or do they have partners that legislate some religion which Allaah has not given permission for?" (42:21)

The Companion, Abdullaah ibn Mas’ud laments, "how will it be when the trials overcome you, in which the young grow old and the old grow senile. And the people take the bid’ah as the sunnah, and when it changes they say: the sunnah has changed. It was said: when will this be O Abu Abdurrahmaan? He replied: when your speakers are many and your scholars are few, and the wealthy ones are plenty and the trustworthy ones are few." (ad-Daarimee)

How true this statement is today, that the innovations have become so widespread in the religion that the people have taken then to be the Sunnah. And when the true scholar speaks out against these innovations he is labeled as a ‘wahhabi’ by the people because to them it seems that he is changing the sunnah. To Allaah we complain of the ignorance of our times!



Only Allaah (SWT) has the right to tell us how to worship Him:

Allaah says, "follow that which has been revealed to you from your Lord, and do not follow as Friends and Protectors other than Him" (7:3)

From the tafseer of this verse we learn that this verse is a categorical statement that the privilege to tell people how to worship Allaah belongs to Allaah Alone. And how could it be otherwise when the true meaning of ibaadah is to worship Allaah in a way which He is Pleased with and not according to our desires, "and who is more astray then the one who follows his own whims and desires devoid of revelation" (28:50)

In this regard the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "I warn you of the newly invented matters (in the religion) and every newly invented matter is an innovation, and every innovation is misguidance, and every misguidance is in the Hellfire" (an-Nasaa’ee)

And he (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) used to say at the beginning of his lectures, "….and the best speech is the Speech of Allaah, and the best guidance is the guidance of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam), and the worst of all affairs are the newly invented matters (in the religion)" (Muslim)

And he (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) commanded us, "whosoever does an action which we have not commanded then it must be rejected." (Muslim)

And again, "whosoever introduces into this religion of ours that which is not part of it then it must be rejects" (Ahmad)

‘And in this hadeeth is a clear evidence that every action which is not legislated in the sharee’ah must be rejected’ [Jaami al-Ulum of ibn Rajab 1/120]

So every bid’ah that is introduced in the religion has to be rejected because only Allaah and His Messenger (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) have the right to legislate in the sharee’ah of Islaam.

Hence in the light of what has preceded we can now give the formal Sharee’ah definition of bid’ah:

"a newly invented way (in beliefs and actions) in the religion, in imitation of the Sharee’ah, by which nearness to Allaah is sought, not being supported by any authentic proof, neither in it’s foundations nor in the manner in which it is performed." [al-I’tisaam 1/231 of ash-Shaatibee]

And in what has preceded is ample evidence for any fair-minded Muslim that all bid’ah is blameworthy, and in fact a major sin. But unfortunately the Muslims are in such a state today that the words of Allaah and His Messenger (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) are no longer enough to convince them and certain groups of people have come up with belief that has very frail grounds in the Sunnah. The belief of ‘bid’ah hasanah’, i.e. a good bid’ah, meaning that a scholar can introduce a new action of worship in Islaam which can be considered to be good as long it does not contradict any of the principles of Islaam. So we resort to the sayings of the Companions and the Imaams to illuminate the road ahead of these people.

The sayings of the Companions:

Abdullaah ibn Umar (RA) states, "every innovation is misguidance, even if the people regard it as good." (ad-Daarimee)

This narration is enough to demolish the concept of ‘a good bid’ah’, for you have amongst the most knowledgeable companions of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) saying the exact opposite. So who do you choose to follow, ibn Umar or these modern day Shaykhs and Mullahs who are Imaams of their own whims and desires.

Abdullaah ibn Abbaas (RA) said, "do not sit with the people of innovation, for verily their sittings are a sickness for the hearts" [ash-Sharee’ah pg 65 of al-Aajurree (d.360)]

Mu’aadh bin Jabal (RA) used to say, whenever he sat in a circle of knowledge, "…and I warn you of what is innovated, for all that is innovated is misguidance" [ash-Sharee’ah pg.55, also Abu Dawood with similar wording]

Abdullaah ibn Mas’ud (RA) said, "follow the sunnah of Muhammad and do not innovate, for what you have been commanded is enough for you." [ad-Daarimee]

Hudhayfah bin al-Yaman said, "every act of worship that the Companions did not do, do not do it" [Abu Dawood]

Is this not enough? That the Companions tell us to follow the way of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) and not to make up new ways of worship? "whomsoever Allaah guides to the truth, none can misguide him, and whomsoever Allaah misguides, none can guide"! [Muslim]



The sayings of the Second and Third generation scholars:

Hasan al-Basree said, "do not sit with the people of innovation, do not debate with them or listen to them" [ad-Daarimee 1/121]

Abu Aaliyah said, "learn Islaam. Then when you have learned Islaam, do not turn away from it to the right or to the left. But be upon the Straight Path and be upon the Sunnah of your Prophet and that which his companions were upon…And beware of these innovations because they cause enmity and hatred amongst you, but stick to the original state of affairs that was there before they divided." [al-Hilya of Abu Nu’aym 2/218]

Sufyaan ath-Thawree, "innovations are more beloved to Satan than sin. Since a sin mat be repented from but an innovation is not repented from" [Sharh Usul I’tiqaad of al-Laalikaa’ee (d.414) no.238]

This is because the innovator believes that he is doing something good and therefore sees no need to repent.

He also said, "…so cling to the original state of affairs" [al-Hilya 6/376] meaning stick to the Way of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) and his Companions.

Imaam al-Awzaa’ee said, "patiently restrict yourselves to the sunnah, stop where the people stopped, say what they said, avoid what they avoided. Take to the path of the salaf, for indeed what was sufficient for them was sufficient for you." [ash-Sharee’ah pg. 58]

Ibraaheem al-Masayrah said, "he who honours an innovator has assisted in the demolition of Islaam" [Sharh Usul I’tiqaad 1/139]

The sayings of the Later Imaams:

Imaam Abu Haneefah said, "stick to the narrations and the way of the salaf, and beware of the newly invented matters for all of it is innovation" [Sawnul Muntaq of as-Suyutee pg.32]

Imaam Maalik said, "he who innovates an innovation in Islaam regarding it as something good, has claimed that Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) has betrayed his trust to deliver the message as Allaah says, ‘this day have I perfected for you your religion’. And whatsoever was not part of the religion then, is not part of the religion today." [al-I’tisaam]

He also said, "how evil are the People of Innovation, we do not give them salaam" [al-Ibaanah of ibn Battah (d.387) no.441]

Imaam Ahmad said, "the fundamental principles of the sunnah with us are:….avoiding innovations and every innovation is misguidance"

As for the narrations from Imaam ash-Shaafi’ee in which he categorizes bid’ah into two, then it is weak as all of it’s chains of narrations depend upon unknown narrators. [al-Bid’ah of Shaykh Saleem al-Hilaalee, al-Masaabeeh fee Salaatit Taraaweeh of as-Suyutee with Alee Hasans footnotes] and even if it were authentic then it would be understood in the linguistic sense as explained by ibn Rajab and others.

Imaam Bukhaaree said, "I have met more than a thousand scholars….(then he mentioned the names of the more prominent in each of the lands that he traveled in)…and I found that they all agreed on the following points:…they all used to prohibit bid’ah - that which the Prophet and his Companions were not upon, because of the saying of Allaah, ‘and hold fast to the rope of Allaah and do not separate’" [Imaam Bukhaaree’s article on belief as quoted in Sharh Usul I’tiqaad 1/170. From amongst the scholars he met were: Ahmad bin Hanbal, Abu Ubaid al-Qaasim, ibn Ma’een, ibn Aasim, ibn Abee Shaybah….]

What I have narrated here is just a small number of the many narrations that I have in front of me from various books, I have tried to quote as best to my ability only authentic narrations, and Allaah knows best. It is good to know that the early Imaams were prolific in writing and warning against bid’ah, and even today we have a number of books from them dealing just with this topic. Amongst them: al-Bid’ah of al-Qarnushi, al-Bid’ah of ibn Waddah, al-I’tisaam of ash-Shaatibee and many more.

So once this topic becomes clear, a truth that none can deny, then know that all these innovations in the religions are a clear denial of the above mentioned verses and ahaadeeth, for none were done by the Companions.

So I leave you with the hadeeth of the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam), "….so he follows my sunnah has been guided, and he who follows the innovations has been destroyed." (Ahmad)

[U]The arguments of the misguided:

Know that every example that the misguided bring from the actions of the companions to prove their belief of a ‘good innovation’, is invalid and it just shows their weak understanding of the Sunnah of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam), for all of these examples have a clear basis in the Sharee’ah, or occurred due to necessity, or from ijtihaad. Insha’allaah I will mention a few of their arguments

1.When Umar (RA) was caliph, he collected the Muslims to pray in congregation for taraaweeh prayers and said, "what a good bid’ah this is" (Bukhaaree), Evidence is derived from this for ‘bid’ah hasanah’ but of course they have misunderstood the true intent of Umar which can be clearly understood if one were to quote the context of this narration.

When the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) first prayed taraaweeh, the Muslims used to pray taraaweeh individually or in small groups, and then for three nights they prayed in one congregation behind the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam), and after this he stopped them doing so by saying, "I feared that it would become obligatory upon you." So after this again, the Muslims would pray individually or in small groups, and they remained like this throughout the rule of Abu Bakr and the beginning of the rule of Umar. Then Umar came to the Mosque and saw the Muslims praying in small groups and so gathered them as one jamaa’ah to pray behind Ubayy bin Ka’b and Tameem ad-Daaree and stated the above phrase. This context is reported in Bukhaaree, the Muwatta and others.

Firstly: how can the action of Umar be considered to be new when the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) did it in his lifetime. Not only that but the Muslims were also in the habit of praying in small groups as well. Hence the praying of taraaweeh in jamaa’ah was well established in the sunnah and the practice of the sahaabah?

Secondly: The Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) gave the reason why he stopped the congregational prayer, for the revelation was still descending, and he feared that praying in obligation might become obligatory upon his nation, and that this might lead to be hard on them. After the death of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) revelation ceased so this fear was no longer present. Hence Umar (RA) reinstated the congregation during his rule because he knew his action could not be made obligatory upon the ummah.

Thirdly: all the companions agreed to this action of Umar (RA), there was a consensus (ijmaa) on this. And the scholars of usul have stated that a consensus cannot occur except when there is a clear text for it in the Sharee'ah.

Fourth: So how do we understand this statement of Umar, "what a good bid’ah this is" when this action that Umar called a bid’ah was done by the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam)? Bid’ah here can only be understood in it’s linguistic sense and not in it’s Sharee'ah sense i.e. when Umar said this he did not mean it in the legal sense that we may understand it today. For how many are the words that mean one thing in the language, but another thing in the Sharee'ah! The linguistic sense is: something new, because praying in one congregation was not present in the rule of Abu Bakr and the earlier period of his own rule.

Hence Abu Yusuf said, "I asked Abu Haneefah about the taraaweeh and what Umar did and he replied, ‘the taraaweeh is a stressed sunnah, and Umar did not do that from his own opinion, and neither was there in his action any innovation, and he did not enjoin it except that there was a foundation for it with him and authorisation from the Prophet…" ['Sharh Mukhtaar' as quoted from in 'al-Ibdaa' (pg. 80) of Shaykh Alee Mahfooz]

2.The hadeeth, "whosoever starts in Islaam a good practice (sunnah), he gets the reward of it and the reward of all those that act on it. And whosoever starts in Islaam an evil practice (sunnah), he gets the evil of it and the evil of all those that act on it." (Muslim)

The evidence they derive from this is that people can invent new practices in Islaam that are either good or bad. But were they to take this hadeeth in it’s full context then it would not be possible to infer such a thing.

The context of the hadeeth states that a group of poor people came to the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) so he asked those around him to give charity, but no-one came forward - so much so that signs of anger could be discerned on the face of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam), so one of the companions stepped forward and gave charity and then the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) mentioned the above statement.

Firstly: the word sunnah used in the hadeeth must be understood in it’s linguistic sense (i.e. practice) not it’s sharee’ah sense (i.e. the life example of Muhammad (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam)) because otherwise it would imply that there is something bad in the sunnah.

Secondly: This companion who gave charity, did not do anything new, for giving charity had been legislated from the very early days of Islaam as the Makki Surahs prove, rather he was simply implementing an already legislated matter. So the statement of the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam), ‘a good sunnah’ was said at a time when the people were reluctant to give charity, so one man gave it and then others followed him - i.e. he RENEWED a sunnah that was being neglected - this is the meaning of ‘good practice’ - renewing an already existing sunnah.

Hence we do not stick just to the specific occurrence in the hadeeth, but we generalize it’s intent as it’s wording is general as is established in usul. The intent of this hadeeth is renewing the Sunnah at a time that it has been neglected. This is why the early scholars of Islaam included this hadeeth under chapter heading such as, "the reward of the one who renews the sunnah" [as done by the 4th century Imaam al-Laalikaa’ee in his encyclopedic work detailing the belief of Ahlus Sunnah, ‘Sharh Usul I’tiqaad Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaa’ah’]

Thirdly: the meaning of ‘bad sunnah’ is to be understood in a similar vein, i.e. the one who renews an evil act will get it’s evil…. and the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) gave the example of the two sons of Adam one killing the other, so the one who killed got the sin of that action and the sin of all those that would kill in the future without their sins decreasing. And killing had been forbidden from the time of the first Prophet (AS) to the last (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam).

Fourthly: the hadeeth uses the terms ‘good’ and ‘bad’, and from what has preceded it is clear that Islaam has already defined in it’s totality all that it is good and bad, and if we were to say otherwise we would then be accusing the religion of incompleteness and deficiency. This is why Imaam ash-Shaafi’ee rejected Istihsaan (declaring something to be good that was not already done so by the Sharee'ah) by saying, "whosoever declares something good has declared it part of the Sharee’ah".

[Humoyun]

Manimcha, bularni ortasida, "Korroche v printsipe", raznoglasiye borde dinni metodologiyasi jikhatidan (izviniyayus u menya Uzbekskiy ochen ploxo) Abdullah, manimcha, v printsipe prav, korroche On proizvodil argumenti osnovannix v konkretnix faktax, a u ostalnix, kak vidno, pustie slova....yeshyo chto skazat' umm..

Manimchade, Abdullahni keltirgan faktlariga jovob berilmasa, bu bahs oldi konkretno, Abdullah silarni (Gomer bilan Mujrimmi) dalil bilan komip tashadi, a silarchi? Yest' u vas konkretnie fakti? Ozi etvotti, man Hanafiyman deb, a silar blin kha deb uni "vova" devossanlar...musurmonchilikda mundoq tsenzura bolmagan...tushunvosanlarmi?

Anu Mujrimchi, Taymiyani kopir devotti, Allah taolodan qorqmiysanmi? Blin, ogzinga kelganni gapirvossan...Agar, Taymiya kopir bolsa sa musurmonda butun unga ergashgan araplaru koprmi? Blin dubayda dakhuya bolganman, osha sen kopr devotgan vovalarchi sandaqa busrmondlardan trilliyon marta religiyasini yaqshi biladi i amalini qoyil qilib qoyadi, jallab.

Sanga ozi dinni kim kelib orgatgan? Alifni kaltak deyoliysanmi ozi? Hanafiyman devossanl, ozim hanafiy bolip 9 yildan berin jumaga chqip hich bir hanafiyni kormaganman (man bilganlarim, korroche govorya) boshqalarri kopir deyishvotganini...

U nas bil mechit v starom Gorode, Masjid Jami "Kukaldash" ...tam videl raznix lyudey, i vaxxabitov a taxrirtsov i drugix, no ya ne vidal ni odnogo musurmanina kotoriy obvinyal drugogo v kafirstve i togdali...boje moy lyudi v nature stali naglet...

Vabshe u menya golova stala krutitsya i stal udivlyatsya kogda vi nachali obvinyat drug druga v kafirstve, i sami ni khrena ne znayete...nu yebani....

v zaklyuchneiye,

u menya vopros k Abdullakh i drugix "forum"chan.

"Kak vi smotrite na fakt chto poslednie vremya, lyudi stali khodit v pyatnichniy molitvu chtobi pokazat lyudyam chto on umeyet chtitat Koran ...prosto eto obichiy stal ochen modnim, osobenno sredi Tashkentsov...kak vi smotrite na eto? A boshqa nomozlarri oqishmaydi, prosto jumaga moda-de, blin, vabshe khueyu v posledniye vremya" Izvinyayus za ne gramotniy post

[mujreem[off]]

Humoyun: 3fb52232, boldi tushunarli, kak govoritsya namek ponyali.
Agar sanga dalilla bilan gapirish kerak bo'lsa dalilla bilan ham gapiruramiza.
San faqat qochib ketmagin, vizov tashashgaku tashading, bu birinchisi.
Ikkinchidan, man nima degan bo'sam o'zimdan to'qib gapirganim yoq, eshitganlarimni ham gapirganim yoq, balkim o'qiganlarimni aytayapman.
I bu yerda publikaga o'ynab har hil bo'lar bo'lmas gapla bilan gapirishni yig'ishtirgin. Man oldin ham forumdagi vovalar bilan anchadan beri tortishib yuribman. Hatto jo'natgan materiallarim ham bo'lgan, olgan javobim esa, san so'fiysan deyishgan holos. sunniyni vovadan ajratib bilish uchun oz bo'lsa ham u bu narsa bilish kerak, man bilganim uchun ajrata olayapman. Lucky man sunniyman degani bilan sunniy bo'lib qolmaydi, ohirgi postida g'irt yolg'on gapirdi, faqatgina o'ziga kelgan nakatdan qochish uchun. San tushunmaysan chunki johilsan. 9 yil machitga qatnaganing bilan aqlli bo'lib qomisan.
Ladno, tushunarli, materiallar va dalillar kerak ekan, keltiraman. San faqat qochmagin, shu yerda bo'lgin va shularni tipirchilashini keyin tomosha qigin. Qani ushandan keyin "faktlar bilan" ko'mib tashashsinchi. Bir qiyinchilik tomoni shundaki, vovalarga qarshi bol'gan materiallar barchasi boshqa tillarda, ularni tarjima qilishga ancha vaqt ketadi. Lekin mayli qilaman, bu problema emas. Gapni ochig'i manga qattiq tegdi sani bu yerda vistupat' qiganing.

Nauchniy faktlarga keladigan bo'lsak, qani oprovergat' qilishsinchi mana bu yerdagi nauchniy faktlarni.
http://www.forum.uz/viewtopic.php?p=73348#73348
Oldin san aytganingdek nauchniy yolga ham bosh urganmiz, lekin bir necha kun qilingan tarjima bekorga qolib ketgan, hech qanday e'tibor ham berishmadi, ko'rmaganga o'zlarini olishdi.

[Amazone]

hmmdaaa... :(

Provokator provokatsiyasini qildi,Kuzatuvchi kuzatib turib uni sepgan benziniga spichka opkeberdi,...i ketdi hammasi boshidan...
Ahli Musulmon,yaxshimas bir birilani go'shlarini yeyishlaring! Islom bitta,hammalaringga yetadi.


hrmtlrm

[Abbas al-Hanafee]

Salamaalaikum wa rahmatullah.

Akhee Adullah-May Allah swt make u strong on Haneef and Hanafiya. Jazakalah khairan for wonderful articles.

Mujreem-Hanafee and ahli sunna do not mean Sufiya. Sufism is based on bida, and full of Shirk, it has nothing to do with Hanafiya, hanafiya has beeen hijacked by peoplelikeyou

[spoon]

This is obviously off the topic, but this is what interests me at all:
why most Mullahs have some strange looking eyes?
I mean whenever they look at you, you start feeling uncomfortable...
Or is it the way they are taught? :)

This is obviously off the topic, but this is what interests me at all:
why most Mullahs have some strange looking eyes?
I mean whenever they look at you, you start feeling uncomfortable...
Or is it the way they are taught? :)
lool

[Dunyokezganqalandar]

Desperado, san o'zing bilan san hech kim bilan ishing yo'q nima qilib chechnyaga yordam bermoqchisan urush bilanmi, ahmoq bo'lasan.
hech qachon yahshilikka qon bilan erishib bo'lmaydi!!!!!!!!!!!!

dunyokezganqalandar, boshshi qotirma bratishka. bir og'iz o'sha bechoralarga 'biz sanlar bilan' deb qoysang ham hursand, harholda tildosh, dindoshmiz, yoki o'rislani ko'tini opurib bunaqa tushinchalarni unutib qo'ydingmi?

qalandar:
____hech qachon yahshilikka qon bilan erishib bo'lmaydi!!!!!!!!!!!!__________ toshini termisanmi borib blya, nima deb valaqlavossan, qonga qon jonga jon, gumanitar fikrlaringni borib g'arbdagi ko'tlarga etgin.

salafi and wahabi or what ever you name them are "true islam".